From andycarvin at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  2 19:58:21 2008
From: andycarvin at yahoo.com (Andy Carvin)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 16:58:21 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [DDN] Volunteers needed for hurricane response online
Message-ID: <669608.32814.qm@web44814.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

Hi everyone,

Over the last few days I've been working with several hundred volunteers, including many veterans of Katrina and the Tsunami, to pull together a number of online resources related to Hurricane Gustav. That storm has passed, but unfortunately, another one named Hanna is expected to slog up the entire US coast later this week. We had an amazing team that managed to pull together an enormous wiki, google maps, sms relays and other tools, but the size and scope of Hanna means we'll need even more volunteers helping out. 

If you're willing to get involved, please visit our project homepage, http://gustav08.ning.com. If you're able to take on a specific task, like help pull together the Google Map or edit sections of the wiki, please let us know by posting a note about what you're willing to do:

http://gustav08.ning.com/forum/topic/show?id=2294159%3ATopic%3A4180

thanks,
andy

 ------------------------
Andy Carvin
andycarvin at yahoo  com
www.andycarvin.com
www.pbs.org/learningnow
------------------------



From paperlesshomework at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  2 04:09:42 2008
From: paperlesshomework at yahoo.com (Paperless Homework)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 01:09:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [DDN] Fwd: Web 2.0 leaves out people with disabilities
In-Reply-To: <a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@[10.0.1.2]>
Message-ID: <333333.96725.qm@web62306.mail.re1.yahoo.com>

Jayne,

You raised a very pertinent points there and realistic. 

I think basically the ones that need help should also be the ones who help rather than waiting and wanting others to help all the time. They are the ones who know best what is needed.

This goes to many charities for such disable people also. You would be disappointed if you try to give them a fishing rod (tools) rather than a fish (donation) on many occassions(nearly 100% so far my experience) you get the cold shoulder with all kinds of excuses.

I tried on many occasions to give them the tools to create contents rather than just contents/or money.... well nothing happens.

Many want the easy way and many love to talk but no actions.

Alan



www.paperlesshomework.com

An elearning solution for rural areas where online/CDs cannot reach.



Get the latest happenings through paperlesshomework tool bar www.paperlesshomework.communitytoolbars.com

--- On Sat, 8/23/08, Jayne Cravens <jc at coyotecommunications.com> wrote:
From: Jayne Cravens <jc at coyotecommunications.com>
Subject: Re: [DDN] Fwd: Web 2.0 leaves out people with disabilities
To: "The Digital Divide Network discussion group" <digitaldivide at digitaldivide.net>
Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008, 10:39 PM

Thanks to everyone who replied. Norbert Bollow <nb at Adaptux.com> wrote:

>  >>I think this is a very important point:  Sometimes it takes only
a
>very small amount of (wisely-directed) effort to achieve victories
>of local significance.  This is particularly significant given that
>such relatively small, local victories are an essential precondition
>for having any hope of any large-scale trend-setting breakthroughs.
>
>>>For example, I would suggest that in any and all informatics
projects
>(not only web development, but also of purely internal informatics
>systems) the question should be raised whether accessibility concerns
>are taken into consideration, and if not, why not.

This is a commitment I would like to see everyone make -- for every 
online or tech-focused project you are on, ask, "Does this project 
meet the standards promoted by W3C? Will this online tool be 
accessible for someone who who has a sight-impairment? Someone with 
hearing impairments? Someone with limited hand movement? Someone 
using an assistive technology tool?"

You will get a lot of arguments like "I don't think we serve that 
many people who have disabilities" or "that would be too
expensive." 
You need to be prepared to address those arguments. Sites like 
http://www.w3.org/ and http://www.knowbility.org can help. But if 
just every person on the Digital Divide Network would ask those 
questions for any tech project they were involved with right now and 
in the future, commercial or nonprofit, imagine what an effect that 
would have.

-- 
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Ms. Jayne Cravens MSc 
Bonn, Germany

http://www.coyotecommunications.com

Volunteer Coordinator
http://www.aidworkers.net

www.ivisit.com id: jcravens.4947
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
_______________________________________________
DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.net with
the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.



      

From fouadbajwa at gmail.com  Tue Sep  2 04:17:11 2008
From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 13:17:11 +0500
Subject: [DDN] World Day Against Software Patents (24 September): Call now
	open for signatures
Message-ID: <701af9f70809020117k76185f07sbb55b04f1f2217cd@mail.gmail.com>

World Day Against Software Patents (24 September): Call now open for
signatures (Benjamin Henrion)

Please sign and spread: http://stopsoftwarepatents.org

"
Considering the following:

      1. The issue of software patents is a global one, and several
governments and patent offices around the world continue to grant
software & business method patents on a daily basis; they are pushing
for legal codification of the practice, such as currently in New
Zealand and India, and via the misappropriation of Free Trade
Agreement instruments;

      2. Previous initiatives as the Noepatents.org petition (approx.
400 000) at the EU level are outdated (notably on the issues of the
central EU patent court) and not open for signatures anymore.

      3. Companies still view software patents as assets. They have
yet to understand that software patents should also be considered
liabilities, especially if they are in the hands of trolls.

      4. Time is on our side as litigation gets spread wide: Markets
learn the hard way that you may not leave reform to patent
professionals. Patent litigation is becoming wide spread in key
markets such as the financial sector, and will be more wide spread in
the software sector in the forthcoming years due to the number of
applications pending;

      5. The United States lacks a coalition of business and civil
society against software patents

       * The lobby gap makes Congress and Senate, the Court of Appeals
for the Federal Circuit (CAFC) and the Supreme Court
susceptible to lobbying from patent industries, holders and patent
professionals. American software creators have been intimidated by the
patent establishment and have failed to make themselves heard.

       * Companies affected by software patent litigation have been
lobbying for reform, but their advocacy for "quality" and "lower
damages" aims at symptoms rather than the roots of the problem.

   For these reasons,

   We declare the 24 September as the World Day Against Software
Patents, in commemoration of the European Parliament First Reading in
2003 with amendments stopping the harmful patenting of software,
guaranteeing that software programmers and businesses can safely
benefit from the fruits of their work under copyright law.

   A Global Petition will be launched which asks to stop software
patents, with some localised versions of the petition for specific
regions, such as New Zealand, India, United States and Europe. The
public will be invited to comment on the draft between the 1st and the
23rd September.
"

--
Benjamin Henrion <bhenrion at ffii.org>
FFII Brussels - +32-484-566109 - +32-2-4148403

-- 

Regards.
--------------------------
Fouad Bajwa

From fouadbajwa at gmail.com  Tue Sep  2 14:43:35 2008
From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 23:43:35 +0500
Subject: [DDN] =?windows-1252?q?Another_IT_Policy_for_Pakistan=3F_-_CIO_Pa?=
	=?windows-1252?q?kistan_-_Fouad_Riaz_Bajwa_takes_a_look=85?=
Message-ID: <701af9f70809021143o6aa2b36cxf47e80f633920fae@mail.gmail.com>

CIO Pakistan - Another IT Policy for Pakistan?
Fouad Riaz Bajwa takes a look?
September 2, 2008
Source http://cio.com.pk/2008/09/another-it-policy-for-pakistan/

For those who are still not aware, the Federal Ministry of Information
Technology and Telecom (MoIT&T), Government of Pakistan are still in
the process of redrafting the IT Policy for Pakistan. While this is a
step in more confused circular pattern, what does this mean for the
Pakistani CIO trying to plan his next infrastructure deployment?
The face of the IT industry is Pakistan is yet to receive another blow
of significant change in one more effort to boost its current state of
affairs of a lingering ecosystem. Let me share some perspectives.
Whether or not this revised policy will have a positive or negative
impact on the IT industry and general business, commerce and industry,
will be determined by its objectives, and current or future actions.

The IT Industry in Pakistan has been booming for the last decade but
at the same time, has been facing a continuous round of set backs over
time due to the changing shape of the shift in international social
and economic dynamics. One of the major markets that the Pakistani IT
business and industry has been catering to is the United States. The
US market has been giving various negative economic shockwaves first
in the form of the "Dot Com Bubble Burst" and the 9/11 disaster that
not only rocked Pakistani IT businesses but also significantly
affected the state of the world's developing economies. Now the US is
under the pressure of increasing oil prices, its global War on
Terrorism activities and of course now its economy facing a recession.

Amidst these shockwaves, the Pakistani IT industry discovered in
detail IT business opportunities in the fields of informatization,
automation and call center services both at the enterprise and small
and medium levels and estimated this market to contribute to the
income of our industry. Major consumers in the local IT market scene
emerged in the form of the Government of Pakistan and its constituent
departments as well as provincial level Governments around the
country. A large number of industrial groups, multinational companies
and the innovative banking and financial services provider segments
have been a major contributor to the local economy.

However, within the identification of a local market for IT and
outsourced services, Pakistan lost a number of large-scale IT firms
due to the shockwaves from abroad and only those firms survived that
had the backup and sought a constructive strategy to gain buy-in from
a plummeting economy. The local IT industry has also seen a
significant increase in revenues not by the software or hardware
industries but due to the foreign investment directed towards the
Telecom Sector de-regularization activity. Investors have established
business investment consortiums and clusters while stepping into
Pakistan from regions like Europe, Scandinavia, Middle East and the
Asia Pacific.

The local IT industry has been reporting significant gains in revenues
with evidence from the State Bank of Pakistan and the Pakistan
Software Export Board but are these gains a grand number to feel pride
in? Unfortunately not! It can be experienced from our close by
neighboring country, that some of their local giants have individual
yearly revenues far exceeding the total revenues derived by the IT
industry within both local and international markets. So where does
the problem lay? In a discussion with a representative from the
world's leading search engine and online advertising player, only one
company in India provides more revenues in online advertising then all
Pakistani companies combined. So what's the real problem?

The problem can be attributed to lack of strategic direction in the
national IT planning activities of course this is where an IT Policy
and its affect on the IT and general commerce comes into play.
National level IT planning also requires a very strategic direction
and focus. It has to be planned in such a way that all stakeholders
are present within the planning activity from the beginning so that
they may today or maybe tomorrow benefit from such a policy or even
the opportunities generated by technology. In order to engage the
stakeholders in an affective manner ensuring full diversified
participation from all sectors of society and economy, such as the
academia, public sector departments, private sector and civil society,
the Government has to use dual means.

First, the Government has to generate the capacity of its citizens to
embrace and engage technology and employ its uses in various venues of
life. Once this has been achieved, a culture of technology becomes the
driving force for a future IT industry development and growth. The
impact of such an industry has both social and economic affects as
technology becomes a daily life tool rather than simply a gadget based
fascination for its users. Now to explain Pakistan's case, we never
had a strategy nor an IT policy that focused on creating a culture and
increasing capacity on an ongoing basis in line with the changing
social and economic environment. Recommendations and policy amendments
have been coming amidst catering to governance economic deficits
ignoring that the IT industry may suffer due to lack of proper
planning and backup support by the government.

Stepping back into our neighbouring country's shoes, their strategic
technology plan was based upon informed research about the changing
dynamics of the world and developed in early 1970's. Its
implementation began in ten year implementation cycles reviewed every
five years. The beauty of their planning was that every time a new
government came, the technology strategic direction was not altered
and allowed to continue its growth. From 1975-1985, they developed the
local technology establishment to cater to the needs of capacity
building. From 1995-2005 they established both a local and
international culture to invest and cultivate their technology talent.
>From the year 2005 onwards, they have initiated the wave of owning and
leading the world's largest ITeS companies in their pledge to become a
super power.

Capacity and Culture are the two key determinants in creating a
technology ecosystem because demand and supply of both human resource
and infrastructure is based upon these two determinants. If there are
no consumers, there is no demand and if there is no demand, there is
no supply, but what if their were abundant consumers as well as demand
but the supply chain was badly affected, would the culture be able to
benefit from skilled manpower? In this case both society and economy
are the culture. To be more precise, let's take the talent crisis into
account. There is uproar by the IT industry that the availability of
skilled IT talent resource is on the decline. How can this be when the
government and academia have claimed to be training thousands of IT
graduates each year?

In Pakistan, it's due to the culture. Capacity has always been there
but the culture to use and benefit from it has been lacking. In our
case, we haven't been able to use technology to our key benefit.
Concentrating IT to only urbanized regions isn't a successful strategy
especially when the country's sixty seven percent population is
Agrarian and the national economy depends heavily on its agricultural
cultivation. This population is also heavily concentrated in the rural
parts of the country and the only technology advantages they may have
today are cell phones or radio sets. I would not attribute television
in this case because our country has an Energy Crisis underway that is
nowhere near its end for at least half a future decade.

Realizing this that the Pakistani population is both 67% agrarian and
rural will help to understand that only 33% of the IT capacity and
culture is only available to 33% of the citizens of Pakistan but only
a minor number of that benefits from technology because there is a
significant lack of language and capacity skills within the general
public of Pakistan. If we practically look around ourselves in the
urban regions, we see a majority of people living in poverty and the
second majority is the middle and upper class mostly participating in
the IT industry and related businesses with only a handful actually
owning IT businesses in the country. Therefore we have to rethink both
as a country and its government that how much IT capacity and culture
have we really developed? How can a new policy help in further
increasing both the capacity and culture for IT adoption and usage by
the rest of the population?

The MoIT&T last year initiated a development project titled the
"National IT Development and Promotion Unit (NIDU)" that targets at
seeking out areas of key importance and multi-stake holder input on
the same before devising policies and guidelines for the better use of
IT in general. There are various stakeholders engaging with NIDU and
MoIT&T at the Pakistan ICT Policy Monitor online mailing list located
online. Pakistan ICT Policy Monitor mailing list contributes to
National IT Policy related discussions and ICT penetration in
Pakistan. The mailing list comprises of legislators, civil society and
various public and private stakeholders. It is located at
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pakistanictpolicy but the 200
members of this forum cannot be considered as the collective voice of
Pakistan, a nation with a population of over 160 million people.

The NIDU policy interventions are currently been taken online and
issues will be deliberated in face-to-face meetings recorded from this
forum as well as stakeholder interaction. Many stakeholders connected
within the policy development framework activities are not able to
engage within these interactions, these also include CIOs from
academia, public and private sectors and the civil society. I would
like to invite CIO Pakistan Magazine readers to join in on these
discussions and recommend means and ways to promote the IT culture and
capacity within the country as well as suggest ways to improve our
export markets for ITeS and BPO offerings.

Everyone in Pakistan has a role to play. CIOs in the country can help
by making stronger recommendations towards the IT Policy. Baseline
information has to be researched as to how CIOs are acquiring and
using technology and what problems they face. In fact, we all need
such baseline information! What is the current state of IT; how many
users of IT services are there in Pakistan; how foreign markets
respond to the handful of Pakistani IT businesses offerings amidst
political instability; the brain drain crisis and now, the national
energy crisis that only large revenue generating companies can tackle.
These are all questions that need to be answered. The new IT policy
drafting activity not only affects the CIO but virtually every
Pakistani citizen that that will connect to the global network of
information available to them.

About the Author:
The author is a member of the working groups making recommendations to
the Ministry of IT & Telecom, Government of Pakistan. Kindly forward
your recommendations and ideas you would like to be included in the
new IT Policy of Pakistan to the author at fouad at ciopakistan.com

From claude.almansi at gmail.com  Tue Sep  2 06:10:14 2008
From: claude.almansi at gmail.com (Claude Almansi)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 12:10:14 +0200
Subject: [DDN] Fwd: Web 2.0 leaves out people with disabilities
In-Reply-To: <a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>
	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>
	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460808220911r553780a2pbf5fee1582cde6ec@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080823113104.5188A220248@quill.bollow.ch>
	<a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
Message-ID: <bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All

About universal design: an interesting collaboration between advocates
of universal design  for both real-life and online accessibility has
started in Italy in the last week, around Santiago Calatrava's bridge
shortly to be opened in Venice (1).  The associations of people with
disabilities had been protesting against the inaccessibility for
people in wheelchairs and for low-sighted people of the project since
2003.  In May 2008, Caltrava himself issued a press release (2)
putting the responsibility for the inaccessibility on the Commune of
Venice's adaptation of his project.

Then Roberto Scano, acomputer accessibility specialist, took up the
issue in his blog (3)  about a week ago because the mayor of Venice
wanted to have the bridge  inaugurated in the presence of the
President of the Italian republic on Sept. 18, and the traditional
media took it up: such a solemn inauguration of something that
violates the Italian constitution and accessibility laws is a bad
idea. Then the right hon. Cacciari gave in about the inauguration, but
fueled the discussion further by accusing the disabled people's
associations of "harming" the city by their objections.

Now such a collaboration is not as obvious as might seem, because of
the different needs of people with different disabilities, and because
of the different technologies involved in online and real-life
accessibility (4). But as Roberto Ellero pointed out in  "Venezia,
ponte di Calatrava, il ponte che divide" (5), the common denominator
is universal design:

"some analogies can be seen, if you have been dealing with these
issues for some years, be it on the Web or in the physical world:
there are analogies between architectural and digital obstacles. There
are also analogies in the ways problems get solved, and in the defects
in these attempts to solve problems. One immediately obvious example
is the fact that the best, most efficient way to produce a work ? be
it a Web video or site, or be it a bridge or a work of architecture ?
a work that is is harmonious, complete and doesn't discriminate
anyone.
This way is accessible planning, i.e. a planning that keeps
accessibility in mind and respects the principles of "Design for all".
(...) this analogy between both worlds is confirmed by the fact that
an a posteriori adaptation, as the "egg-way" (6) in the case of
Calatrava's bridge, produces two parallel worlds but does not unite
them ? just as with parallel Web sites made to offer an alternative
path for people with disabilities. How often have we chanced upon
alternative Web sites that ask the user: "Are you are you non-disabled
or non-seeing?", and if the person answers: "I'm non-seeing", she or
he gets invited to a different viewing, to a different path from the
one used by seeing people."

Design-for-all or universal design might not be feasible in all cases,
but it should certainly be striven at.

Best

Claude

(1) I tried to post something about it earlier but didn't even get the
"waiting for moderation" message, so there probably was a glitch.
(2) "Statement From the Office of Santiago Calatrava: Quarto Ponte sul
Canal Grande" <http://www.prnewswire.co.uk/cgi/news/release?id=197481>
(3) see <http://robertoscano.info/tag/calatrava/> - I also gathered
these and some more links on the issue at
<http://www.diigo.com/user/calmansi/%22Cacciari+accessibilit%C3%A0%22?tab=250>.
(4) For instance, in his comment to
<http://robertoscano.info/random-bits/calatrava-ci-siam-scordati-i-disabili-visivi/>
[Calatrava: did we forget people with visual disability?], Franco
Bomprezzi said "Actually, I had mentioned it in my open letter to
Cacciari that Roberto [Scano] published here too (...) But it is true
that common [run of the mill] accessibility culture concentrates on
people in wheelchairs, and anyway the obstacles they face don't get
eliminated either."  Yet as to digital accessibility, the "common
culture" tends to focus only on visual obstacles...
(5) Video (with captions and transcriptions in Italian and English) in
<http://www.webmultimediale.org/videoblog/2008/08/venezia_ponte_di_calatrava_il.html>
(6) The "egg-way" (ovovia)  "solution" is described further down in
the transcript in
<http://www.webmultimediale.org/videoblog/2008/08/venezia_ponte_di_calatrava_il.html>.
Pictures of the ovovia project in
<http://www.comune.venezia.it/flex/cm/pages/ServeBLOB.php/L/IT/IDPagina/3691>:
apart from the fact it doesn't address the obstacles for low-sighted
people,  if I were wheelchair-bound, I'd absolutely hate the idea of
being imprisoned in a kind of UFO thing gliding outside the bridge on
a single axis for several minutes - especially on a windy day.

On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 4:39 PM, Jayne Cravens
<jc at coyotecommunications.com> wrote:
> Thanks to everyone who replied. Norbert Bollow <nb at Adaptux.com> wrote:
>
>>  >>I think this is a very important point:  Sometimes it takes only a
>>very small amount of (wisely-directed) effort to achieve victories
>>of local significance.  This is particularly significant given that
>>such relatively small, local victories are an essential precondition
>>for having any hope of any large-scale trend-setting breakthroughs.
>>
>>>>For example, I would suggest that in any and all informatics projects
>>(not only web development, but also of purely internal informatics
>>systems) the question should be raised whether accessibility concerns
>>are taken into consideration, and if not, why not.
>
> This is a commitment I would like to see everyone make -- for every
> online or tech-focused project you are on, ask, "Does this project
> meet the standards promoted by W3C? Will this online tool be
> accessible for someone who who has a sight-impairment? Someone with
> hearing impairments? Someone with limited hand movement? Someone
> using an assistive technology tool?"
>
> You will get a lot of arguments like "I don't think we serve that
> many people who have disabilities" or "that would be too expensive."
> You need to be prepared to address those arguments. Sites like
> http://www.w3.org/ and http://www.knowbility.org can help. But if
> just every person on the Digital Divide Network would ask those
> questions for any tech project they were involved with right now and
> in the future, commercial or nonprofit, imagine what an effect that
> would have.
>
> --
> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
> Ms. Jayne Cravens MSc
> Bonn, Germany
>
> http://www.coyotecommunications.com
>
> Volunteer Coordinator
> http://www.aidworkers.net
>
> www.ivisit.com id: jcravens.4947
> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>




-- 
Claude Almansi

From tabeles at hotmail.com  Tue Sep  2 09:19:56 2008
From: tabeles at hotmail.com (tom abeles)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:19:56 -0500
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY108-W523B60B1A29B48FC5F5014A75F0@phx.gbl>


Hi Steve

I think we are in agreement, though yours is, perhaps, more direct- my problem with preference for wordsmithing 

My consistent argument has been around the concern that within the development community there has been a proclivity to default to "technology", soft or hard. I really appreciate the ideas of Paulo Freire and folks in The Hunger Project. We did not get ourselves, as humans, into the mess that we have across our planet over night and we can not expect to work our way out of this with alacrity. What we contribute may not be understood or appreciated until long after we have disappeared. And, therein lies one of the problems in today's world where we expect the dark to be dispersed with the flick of a switch. Funding agencies need to see "results" and few can stay the course or are willing to do so. Similarly, few humans have the commitment, especially when they are faced with time/financial constraints and a cornacupia of options which they can "try on", like a designer watch. The other issue has to do with not knowing-not knowing if the "button pushed" opens the door to treasure six levels further on in the game of life or drops the treasure into a non-accessible tar pit.

And that is why we have modern day keepers of the flames at Delphi, Oracles with the laptops and models rather than cast entrails, Tarot decks and horoscopes. And that is why liberal thinking persons embraced the fascist ideal of a benevolent dictator, Plato's philosopher kings.

It is also why we default to technology. As I have pointed out before, the EU dumping milk on the market can destroy the livelihood of a woman who walks miles to try to sell her milk in a local market, CBI legislation and political pressure can allow dumped US agriculture to disrupt an "inefficient" farm network with concomitant consequences- something no technology can reverse. A rogue trader in the financial markets can send shudders through the entire world, as did the greed in the recent real estate markets in the US. 

I have seen families emotionally torn because they want their children to learn but if they are in school they can't work and work means food on the table for the entire family. OLPC?  Some folks, putting their kids to work, are committing the ultimate sacrifice of eating their seed potatoes.

As a hard scientist, let me say that I love tech. It is a razor sharp two-edged sword and, like the magic wand of the Sorcerer's Apprendices, has potential for great harm in the hands of the hands of persons lacking in wisdom.

The metonymic "digital divide" represents that mythical armamentarium equivalent to Batman's tool belt or some pharmaceutical formulary, more a mix of paliatives and placibos to avoid having to deal with the core problems facing humans ever since Adam bit into the apple of knowledge.

thoughts?

tom

tom abeles

> Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 09:49:35 -0700
> From: steveeskow at gmail.com
> To: digitaldivide at digitaldivide.net
> Subject: Re: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
> 
> Tom and all,
> 
> Your message suggests--to me at least--the need for discussions such as this
> to go back to first principles from time to time.
> 
> Are you right about the "unspoken belief" driving this discussion: that
> "closing a digital divide is the sine qua non leveling the economic (and
> hence all others) playing field"?
> 
> First: computers and cell phones--then food, clothing, shelter? First:
> economics: and economics will provide education and social and political
> reform?
> 
> Those of us who do spend time in the poor world are used to seeing a crop of
> computers in a school closet, or hidden behind a curtain: no one knows how
> to repair them, keep them running--or what to do with them when they are
> running.
> 
> Is it the hardware and software divide that is our central concern here, our
> goal to get as many computer per capita over there as we have here? Or is
> our goal the information and knowledge divide, with the computer the
> intermediary that gets the information about irrigation and bed netting  and
> the alternatives to kerosene lighting to the people who need it?
> 
> If it's the latter, we might aim to get one computer to a poor rural
> village, train one literate person in its use, and have him or her get the
> information about irrigation and kerosene and bed netting to the people who
> need it, perhaps using community radio as the disseminator.
> 
> Is that one way of easing the "digital divide"?
> 
> Steve Eskow
> 
> On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 7:15 AM, tom abeles <tabeles at hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> >
> >
> > I am not certain that I am in agreement with Maria Laura's definition which
> > appears to be tautological in nature.
> > I am also not certain that engaging in an intellectual reparte makes sense
> > in a list where the unspoken belief is that
> > closing a digital divide is the sine qua non for leveling the economic (and
> > hence all others) playing field.
> >
> > Deal and Development are Humpty Dumpty terms ( a word means what I want it
> > to mean). Perhaps Deal has a pejorative
> > connotation while Development has perceived positive sensibility?
> > Debatable! Maybe a little time, a deep breath and some
> > philosophy/humanities to temper those standing at the ready with their
> > Blackberry might make sense? Right now the US education system
> > is so enamored with educating for the science/tech/engineering/math that
> > programs for the humanities and social sciences are being mothballed.
> >
> > Tour the "developing world" and look at the "Development" skeletons, like
> > Shelly's Ozymandias- the result of "Deals".
> >
> > tom
> >
> > tom abeles
> >
> > > > Sarah Blackmun-Eskow wrote:
> > > > > What's the difference between a development phenomenon and an
> > > > > economic "deal" or phenomenon?
> > ---------------
> > > ...An economic phenomenon can be almost anything related to markets, and
> > > therefore transactions. The word "deal" refers to this transaction view.
> > > Development, on the other hand, involves a value judgment. A development
> > > phenomenon means that something good or desirable has taken place, and
> > > different groups may make different value judgments as to the
> > desirability
> > > or goodness of a phenomenon or situation....
> >
> > > Maria Laura
> > ------------------------------------------
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > See what people are saying about Windows Live.  Check out featured posts.
> > http://www.windowslive.com/connect?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_connect2_082008
> > _______________________________________________
> > DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> > DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> > http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> > To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.netwith the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
> >
> _______________________________________________
> DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.net with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.

_________________________________________________________________
Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you.  Find new ways to share.
http://www.windowslive.com/explore/photogallery/posts?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Photo_Gallery_082008

From cnd at knowprose.com  Tue Sep  2 09:20:50 2008
From: cnd at knowprose.com (Taran Rampersad)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 09:20:50 -0400
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>

I'm really feeling sorry for the dead horse I've been beating, but it 
seems it needs to run a few more laps. That would be mobile phone - the 
future of computing is being discussed on another email list I 
participate on with the changed context that the mobile phone brings.

In essence, the PC doesn't really know it's dead yet - partly because it 
isn't dead *yet* and also because no one really seems to understand how 
the market is changing. The mobile phone has forever changed the 
landscape - even gaining special mention in the UNESCO report brought 
out this year. If anything, the mobile phone is accidentally closing the 
digital divide. After all, it's ubiquitous even in nations that are 
pretty good at avoiding change (i.e., the developing world).

That said, I have yet to see how disseminating information on bed 
netting on the Internet helps with dengue and malaria - and the same 
applies to irrigation (which I have been doing myself lately). Bed 
netting is a fact of life that many people grow up with - the true 
problem is *affording* it. Irrigation is a common sense use of science 
which varies upon application, so it doesn't translate well to the web 
until you can upload topography and soil type data and assure that the 
results are near perfect.

No, maybe simply participating in discussion is the first step. Thus, 
the mobile phone. The truth is that the developing world doesn't need 
PCs as much as it needs better mobile phones and telecommunications 
regulation. Importing PCs into developing nations that have no legal or 
other infrastructure for disposal only pollutes developing nations that 
need the very fertile soil that is being polluted. The same applies to 
mobile phones as well, unfortunately.

What we need to do, IMHO, is stop playing with the tiger's tail if we 
have no plans for dealing with the teeth.

Steve Eskow wrote:
> Is it the hardware and software divide that is our central concern here, our
> goal to get as many computer per capita over there as we have here? Or is
> our goal the information and knowledge divide, with the computer the
> intermediary that gets the information about irrigation and bed netting  and
> the alternatives to kerosene lighting to the people who need it?
>
> If it's the latter, we might aim to get one computer to a poor rural
> village, train one literate person in its use, and have him or her get the
> information about irrigation and kerosene and bed netting to the people who
> need it, perhaps using community radio as the disseminator.
>
> Is that one way of easing the "digital divide"?
>
> Steve Eskow
>   
--
Taran Rampersad
cnd at knowprose.com

http://www.knowprose.com
http://www.your2ndplace.com
http://www.opendepth.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/

"Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
"The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." - Nikola Tesla


From cnd at knowprose.com  Tue Sep  2 09:26:24 2008
From: cnd at knowprose.com (Taran Rampersad)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 09:26:24 -0400
Subject: [DDN] handicapped access ressources
In-Reply-To: <48BA804E.5060901@comunica.org>
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@[10.0.1.2]>	<48AFF0A0.10608@knowprose.com>
	<48BA804E.5060901@comunica.org>
Message-ID: <48BD3F00.3050802@knowprose.com>

A.K. Mahan wrote:
> Colleagues,
>
> Since Tamparand 
Taran Rampersad, thanks. There is originality in that particular use of 
my name which did bring a smile to my face.
> brings up the issue of Universal Design, here is a good 
> definitive refererence for people unfamiliar with this:
>                 The Canadian Human Rights Commission (2006) 
> /International Best Practice in Universal Design: A Global Review/, is a 
> fairly technical and practical document (e.g. how high should handrails 
> be, how much room a wheelchair needs physically turn around it, how much 
> space a computer terminal needs to accommodate a week chair, access 
> routes, saftety, etc., type of thing).
Interesting. I'd love to see a common standard for many of these things, 
but it can also lead down the path to bureaucracy of standards that 
results in things like ISO labeling of coffeemakers in the workplace. 
That can be self defeating...
>
> A number of good resources have been noted during this discussion.
> Is there a place were these are being compiled on DDN? (I would have 
> some to add for different aspects of disabled access, as well as some 
> contributions to architecture and design to promote, encourage, 
> stimulate and make create productive opportunities for women and girls 
> in the emerging knowledge society - both at home and via public access 
> spaces.
>   
I'm interested in what you think of the gender divide and how it can be 
changed by design - and it's an honest inquiry. I'm not sure I 
understand the problem, thus I am not sure I understand the search for a 
solution.

--
Taran Rampersad
cnd at knowprose.com

http://www.knowprose.com
http://www.your2ndplace.com
http://www.opendepth.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/

"Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
"The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." - Nikola Tesla


From SiobhanChamp-Blackwell at creighton.edu  Tue Sep  2 09:31:35 2008
From: SiobhanChamp-Blackwell at creighton.edu (Champ-Blackwell, Siobhan)
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:31:35 -0500
Subject: [DDN] FW: [CLAStalk-list] webinar: underserved populations and new
	media use
Message-ID: <BB3EEC584579204DB6E2CA0F6DB7566F0F4C75EB@exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu>

https://www2.gotomeeting.com/register/741956532 - the link in the email below breaks. Try this one instead.
siobhan

Siobhan Champ-Blackwell, MSLIS
Community Outreach Liaison
National Network of Libraries of Medicine,? MidContinental Region
Creighton University Health Sciences Library
2500 California Plaza
Omaha, NE 68178
800-338-7657 in CO,KS,MO,NE,UT,WY
402-280-4156 outside the region 
siobhan at creighton.edu
http://nnlm.gov/mcr/bhic/? (Web Log)
http://www.digitaldivide.net/profile/siobhanchamp-blackwell (Digital Divide Network Profile)
? Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail


-----Original Message-----
From: clastalk-list-bounces at diversityrx.org [mailto:clastalk-list-bounces at diversityrx.org] On Behalf Of RCCHC at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 3:25 PM
To: CLAStalk-list at diversityrx.org
Subject: [CLAStalk-list] webinar: underserved populations and new media use

         
 
Dear  Colleagues,

On Wednesday, September 24th 2008 at 3:00  pm (EST), The Office of HIV/AIDS 
Policy's AIDS.gov will conduct a 30-minute  webinar, "Underserved Populations 
and New Media  Use".  
I invite  you to join and listen as experts address:  Is there a "digital  
divide"? How are underserved communities using new media? How can we  use new 
media to reach underserved communities with HIV/AIDS  messages? The webinar will 
also include a Q&A  session.   
 

Speakers  will include Fard Johnmar, Founder of Envision Solutions,  LLC, and 
Alejandro Garcia-Barbon, Senior Technical Advisor to  IQ Solutions, Inc. and 
NIDA's  "Drugs + HIV > Learn the  Link" Campaign.  
 

Please  click _HERE_ 
(http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001c2SBSXYkInYJcKBJEv9J5DT9Dy2AqJECniWlo_vFE5987AOmme58MOGZUZuFoZGbAYUFnbcbU1p1edZEIBReB0_hoAbHZiuh_ZWrQ--VI19R7kgBcEWXz1A2BbTTcWh5GOouaD6weK0Rx-waMnYFMA== )  to  register for this free 
webinar. I also encourage you to  circulate this information among your 
colleagues.  If you have  any questions about the call, please contact Jennie Anderson 
at  janderson at jsi.com or  415-814-2407.
Regards,

Miguel  Gomez
Director,  AIDS.gov



**************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel 
deal here.      
(http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047)
_______________________________________________
CLAStalk-list mailing list
CLAStalk-list at diversityrx.org
http://lists.diversityrx.org/mailman/listinfo/clastalk-list

From molly.uzoh at learningright.com  Wed Sep  3 13:03:50 2008
From: molly.uzoh at learningright.com (Molly E. Uzoh)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 10:03:50 -0700
Subject: [DDN] FW: [Systers] CRA-W CAPP Advanced Career Mentoring Workshop -
	Deadline Extended to September 9th!
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAFZ/slVC0j9HloQByV6OOmrCgAAAEAAAABRNQtW35atNuMcxsHhQpkkBAAAAAA==@learningright.com>

FYI.

The goal of the 2008 CAPP Professional Development workshop is to increase
the percentage of Computer Science and Engineering women faculty members and
researchers who reach the top of their respective career tracks.

Please explore/pass on.

Mary (Molly) Uzoh, CEO/Principal Consultant
Learning Right Technologies, LLC
P. O. Box 51616
San Jose, CA 95151
Phone: 408-649-5872, Cell: 408-826-2167
http://www.learningright.com

-----Original Message-----
From: systers-bounces at athena.systers.org
[mailto:systers-bounces at athena.systers.org] On Behalf Of Carla Romero
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 2:25 PM
To: systers+mentoring11 at athena.systers.org
Subject: [Systers] CRA-W CAPP Advanced Career Mentoring Workshop - Deadline
Extended to September 9th!


Greetings:

CRA-W has extended the deadline for Advanced Career Mentoring Workshop. Ple=
ase apply and/or encourage your colleagues to apply for this valuable works=
hop targeted at Associate Professors and researchers in industrial and gove=
rnment labs. Please feel free to distribute this message widely. Thank you =
for helping us spread the word!

Carla


************************************************
CAPP Advanced Career Mentoring Workshop
Application Deadline: extended to September 9, 2008

CRA-W is pleased to announce that applications are now being accepted for t=
he
2008 CAPP Professional Development workshop.  The goal of the workshop is t=
o
increase the percentage of Computer Science and Engineering women faculty
members and researchers who reach the top of their respective career tracks=
:
faculty members by being promoted to full professor and researchers in
industrial or governmental labs by being promoted to the top of their
institution's technical ladder or by entering research management.

The Advanced Career Mentoring Workshop has been expanded to three tracks as
follows: Cohort of Associate Professors Project-Research (which focuses on
women faculty in research institutions); Cohort of Associate Professors
Project-Education (which focuses on women faculty in primarily teaching
institutions); Cohort of Advanced Professionals-Labs (which focuses on wome=
n
researchers in industrial and government labs).

As with previous years, the cornerstone of the CAPP workshop will be the
involvement of senior women, appointed as CRA-W Distinguished Professors or
Researchers, who will actively participate in the program as role models,
mentors, and advisers to the cohort. The project will build a community of
associate professors and senior labs researchers, providing them with
mentoring, leadership training, encouragement, and ongoing peer-support
activities. The highly interactive workshop will include a Professional
Development Workshop, a series of smaller meetings in conjunction with
technical conferences/seminars, and ongoing electronically-based support
activities.

The two-day intensive CAPP Professional Development Workshop will be held
November 14-15, 2008 at the Inn at Loretto, Santa Fe, New Mexico.

On-line applications and requests for travel support to the CAPP Workshop a=
re
now being accepted at http://www.cra.org/Activities/craw/capp/. The
application deadline is September 9, 2008.

Kathleen Fisher, CAPP-L Co-Director
Joan Francioni, CAPP-E Co-Director
Susanne Hambrusch, CAPP-R Co-Director

To unsubscribe from this conversation, send email to
<systers+mentoring11+unsubscribe at athena.systers.org> or visit
<http://athena.systers.org/mailman/options/systers?override=2084&preference=
0>
To contribute to this conversation, use your mailer's reply-all or
reply-group command or send your message to
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To start a new conversation, send email to <systers+new@@athena.systers.org>
To unsubscribe entirely from systers, send email to
<systers-request@@athena.systers.org> with subject unsubscribe.


From ilan at takingitglobal.org  Wed Sep  3 13:37:30 2008
From: ilan at takingitglobal.org (Ilan Tsekhman)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 11:37:30 -0600
Subject: [DDN] E-Government
Message-ID: <F4E9BE2D-1233-4FF9-BB7D-04167F9AA929@takingitglobal.org>

Hello all,

My apologies for getting the monthly discussion topic out a few days  
late.


As you may know the UN recently putout a survey on e-government  
readiness amongst its member states. There is more information on the  
survey available at http://www.unpan.org/egovkb/global_reports/08report.htm 
  and the survey itself can be downloaded at http://unpan1.un.org/intradoc/groups/public/documents/un/unpan028607.pdf


I thought this might be a good opportunity to discuss the strengths  
and weaknesses of e-government and whether or not the slower adoption  
of e-government technologies in certain countries is just another  
manifestation of the digital divide.



From steveeskow at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 14:32:40 2008
From: steveeskow at gmail.com (Steve Eskow)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 11:32:40 -0700
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <BAY108-W523B60B1A29B48FC5F5014A75F0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY108-W523B60B1A29B48FC5F5014A75F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <d9d15ba30809031132k24402e45id8f8d6f28679517e@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Tom,
There is indeed the regular "default to technology" that you propose: we are
a nation of technophiles. And given the wealth of the rich nations, and the
role that technology has played in generating that wealth, the technophilia
is understandable, if misguided.

In education we've watched a parade of new technologies promising to
transform teaching and learning: the telegraph, radio, the telephone, film,
television. And now, of course, the enthusiasm for "21st century"
technologies, the computer and the cell phone.  So far, it would seem, the
new technologies have done little more than their predecessors to energize
and refashion learning.

New technologies do indeed create new spaces of possibilities. Bed netting
can indeed drastically curtail episodes of malaria. But how to move such a
technology successfully into a community that has lived without it raises a
long list of questions and issues that have to be addressed before the
netting can do its work: questions of culture and custom, finance, living
space, for examples.

Computers can indeed benefit education. But:. . .

Electricity, and paying for it. Servicing the computers, and who can do it.
Teaching with them, and who will teach the teachers. And so much more.

The "divide" is part of a larger "situation." If technology enthusiasts
haven't the patience and the skill to study and take into account the larger
situation which will surround a new technology, they can do more harm than
good.

Steve

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:19 AM, tom abeles <tabeles at hotmail.com> wrote:

>
> Hi Steve
>
> I think we are in agreement, though yours is, perhaps, more direct- my
> problem with preference for wordsmithing
>
> My consistent argument has been around the concern that within the
> development community there has been a proclivity to default to
> "technology", soft or hard. I really appreciate the ideas of Paulo Freire
> and folks in The Hunger Project. We did not get ourselves, as humans, into
> the mess that we have across our planet over night and we can not expect to
> work our way out of this with alacrity. What we contribute may not be
> understood or appreciated until long after we have disappeared. And, therein
> lies one of the problems in today's world where we expect the dark to be
> dispersed with the flick of a switch. Funding agencies need to see "results"
> and few can stay the course or are willing to do so. Similarly, few humans
> have the commitment, especially when they are faced with time/financial
> constraints and a cornacupia of options which they can "try on", like a
> designer watch. The other issue has to do with not knowing-not knowing if
> the "button pushed" opens the door to treasu
>  re six levels further on in the game of life or drops the treasure into a
> non-accessible tar pit.
>
> And that is why we have modern day keepers of the flames at Delphi, Oracles
> with the laptops and models rather than cast entrails, Tarot decks and
> horoscopes. And that is why liberal thinking persons embraced the fascist
> ideal of a benevolent dictator, Plato's philosopher kings.
>
> It is also why we default to technology. As I have pointed out before, the
> EU dumping milk on the market can destroy the livelihood of a woman who
> walks miles to try to sell her milk in a local market, CBI legislation and
> political pressure can allow dumped US agriculture to disrupt an
> "inefficient" farm network with concomitant consequences- something no
> technology can reverse. A rogue trader in the financial markets can send
> shudders through the entire world, as did the greed in the recent real
> estate markets in the US.
>
> I have seen families emotionally torn because they want their children to
> learn but if they are in school they can't work and work means food on the
> table for the entire family. OLPC?  Some folks, putting their kids to work,
> are committing the ultimate sacrifice of eating their seed potatoes.
>
> As a hard scientist, let me say that I love tech. It is a razor sharp
> two-edged sword and, like the magic wand of the Sorcerer's Apprendices, has
> potential for great harm in the hands of the hands of persons lacking in
> wisdom.
>
> The metonymic "digital divide" represents that mythical armamentarium
> equivalent to Batman's tool belt or some pharmaceutical formulary, more a
> mix of paliatives and placibos to avoid having to deal with the core
> problems facing humans ever since Adam bit into the apple of knowledge.
>
> thoughts?
>
> tom
>
> tom abeles
>
> > Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 09:49:35 -0700
> > From: steveeskow at gmail.com
> > To: digitaldivide at digitaldivide.net
> > Subject: Re: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
> >
> > Tom and all,
> >
> > Your message suggests--to me at least--the need for discussions such as
> this
> > to go back to first principles from time to time.
> >
> > Are you right about the "unspoken belief" driving this discussion: that
> > "closing a digital divide is the sine qua non leveling the economic (and
> > hence all others) playing field"?
> >
> > First: computers and cell phones--then food, clothing, shelter? First:
> > economics: and economics will provide education and social and political
> > reform?
> >
> > Those of us who do spend time in the poor world are used to seeing a crop
> of
> > computers in a school closet, or hidden behind a curtain: no one knows
> how
> > to repair them, keep them running--or what to do with them when they are
> > running.
> >
> > Is it the hardware and software divide that is our central concern here,
> our
> > goal to get as many computer per capita over there as we have here? Or is
> > our goal the information and knowledge divide, with the computer the
> > intermediary that gets the information about irrigation and bed netting
>  and
> > the alternatives to kerosene lighting to the people who need it?
> >
> > If it's the latter, we might aim to get one computer to a poor rural
> > village, train one literate person in its use, and have him or her get
> the
> > information about irrigation and kerosene and bed netting to the people
> who
> > need it, perhaps using community radio as the disseminator.
> >
> > Is that one way of easing the "digital divide"?
> >
> > Steve Eskow
> >
> > On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 7:15 AM, tom abeles <tabeles at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > I am not certain that I am in agreement with Maria Laura's definition
> which
> > > appears to be tautological in nature.
> > > I am also not certain that engaging in an intellectual reparte makes
> sense
> > > in a list where the unspoken belief is that
> > > closing a digital divide is the sine qua non for leveling the economic
> (and
> > > hence all others) playing field.
> > >
> > > Deal and Development are Humpty Dumpty terms ( a word means what I want
> it
> > > to mean). Perhaps Deal has a pejorative
> > > connotation while Development has perceived positive sensibility?
> > > Debatable! Maybe a little time, a deep breath and some
> > > philosophy/humanities to temper those standing at the ready with their
> > > Blackberry might make sense? Right now the US education system
> > > is so enamored with educating for the science/tech/engineering/math
> that
> > > programs for the humanities and social sciences are being mothballed.
> > >
> > > Tour the "developing world" and look at the "Development" skeletons,
> like
> > > Shelly's Ozymandias- the result of "Deals".
> > >
> > > tom
> > >
> > > tom abeles
> > >
> > > > > Sarah Blackmun-Eskow wrote:
> > > > > > What's the difference between a development phenomenon and an
> > > > > > economic "deal" or phenomenon?
> > > ---------------
> > > > ...An economic phenomenon can be almost anything related to markets,
> and
> > > > therefore transactions. The word "deal" refers to this transaction
> view.
> > > > Development, on the other hand, involves a value judgment. A
> development
> > > > phenomenon means that something good or desirable has taken place,
> and
> > > > different groups may make different value judgments as to the
> > > desirability
> > > > or goodness of a phenomenon or situation....
> > >
> > > > Maria Laura
> > > ------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > See what people are saying about Windows Live.  Check out featured
> posts.
> > > http://www.windowslive.com/connect?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_connect2_082008
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> > > DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> > > http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> > > To unsubscribe, send a message to
> digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.netwith the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the
> body of the message.
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> > DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> > http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> > To unsubscribe, send a message to
> digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.net with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the
> body of the message.
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you.  Find new ways to share.
>
> http://www.windowslive.com/explore/photogallery/posts?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Photo_Gallery_082008
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> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
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>

From X.L at headsonfire.org  Wed Sep  3 16:02:06 2008
From: X.L at headsonfire.org (Xavier Leonard)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 13:02:06 -0700
Subject: [DDN] Fwd: Web 2.0 leaves out people with disabilities
In-Reply-To: <bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>
	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>
	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460808220911r553780a2pbf5fee1582cde6ec@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080823113104.5188A220248@quill.bollow.ch>
	<a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4ea9ca300809031302g2b6c3235ubb3082816e9af742@mail.gmail.com>

One thought that I've been spinning out lately really points out the
irony of this discussion.  I've been thinking about the debt that Web
2.0 technologies (really, the web itself) owe to people with
disabilities and how the general success of Web 2.0 validates a
Universal Design approach.  Here are the bread crumbs:

many web 2.0 technologies employ xml >>  xml evolved from  sgml >>
one Charles Goldfarb's main motivations for developing sgml was to
make books more accessible to people with visual disabilities.

a little more about this (very little, unfortunately) can be found in
this Goldfarb bio: http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/CGbioFull.htm

Since I'm a big fan of both XML and Universal Design, I've found this
natural correspondence between markup language and accessibility
interesting for awhile now...

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 3:10 AM, Claude Almansi <claude.almansi at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi All
>
> About universal design: an interesting collaboration between advocates
> of universal design  for both real-life and online accessibility has
> started in Italy in the last week, around Santiago Calatrava's bridge
> shortly to be opened in Venice (1).  The associations of people with
> disabilities had been protesting against the inaccessibility for
> people in wheelchairs and for low-sighted people of the project since
> 2003.  In May 2008, Caltrava himself issued a press release (2)
> putting the responsibility for the inaccessibility on the Commune of
> Venice's adaptation of his project.
>
> Then Roberto Scano, acomputer accessibility specialist, took up the
> issue in his blog (3)  about a week ago because the mayor of Venice
> wanted to have the bridge  inaugurated in the presence of the
> President of the Italian republic on Sept. 18, and the traditional
> media took it up: such a solemn inauguration of something that
> violates the Italian constitution and accessibility laws is a bad
> idea. Then the right hon. Cacciari gave in about the inauguration, but
> fueled the discussion further by accusing the disabled people's
> associations of "harming" the city by their objections.
>
> Now such a collaboration is not as obvious as might seem, because of
> the different needs of people with different disabilities, and because
> of the different technologies involved in online and real-life
> accessibility (4). But as Roberto Ellero pointed out in  "Venezia,
> ponte di Calatrava, il ponte che divide" (5), the common denominator
> is universal design:
>
> "some analogies can be seen, if you have been dealing with these
> issues for some years, be it on the Web or in the physical world:
> there are analogies between architectural and digital obstacles. There
> are also analogies in the ways problems get solved, and in the defects
> in these attempts to solve problems. One immediately obvious example
> is the fact that the best, most efficient way to produce a work ? be
> it a Web video or site, or be it a bridge or a work of architecture ?
> a work that is is harmonious, complete and doesn't discriminate
> anyone.
> This way is accessible planning, i.e. a planning that keeps
> accessibility in mind and respects the principles of "Design for all".
> (...) this analogy between both worlds is confirmed by the fact that
> an a posteriori adaptation, as the "egg-way" (6) in the case of
> Calatrava's bridge, produces two parallel worlds but does not unite
> them ? just as with parallel Web sites made to offer an alternative
> path for people with disabilities. How often have we chanced upon
> alternative Web sites that ask the user: "Are you are you non-disabled
> or non-seeing?", and if the person answers: "I'm non-seeing", she or
> he gets invited to a different viewing, to a different path from the
> one used by seeing people."
>
> Design-for-all or universal design might not be feasible in all cases,
> but it should certainly be striven at.
>
> Best
>
> Claude
>
> (1) I tried to post something about it earlier but didn't even get the
> "waiting for moderation" message, so there probably was a glitch.
> (2) "Statement From the Office of Santiago Calatrava: Quarto Ponte sul
> Canal Grande" <http://www.prnewswire.co.uk/cgi/news/release?id=197481>
> (3) see <http://robertoscano.info/tag/calatrava/> - I also gathered
> these and some more links on the issue at
> <http://www.diigo.com/user/calmansi/%22Cacciari+accessibilit%C3%A0%22?tab=250>.
> (4) For instance, in his comment to
> <http://robertoscano.info/random-bits/calatrava-ci-siam-scordati-i-disabili-visivi/>
> [Calatrava: did we forget people with visual disability?], Franco
> Bomprezzi said "Actually, I had mentioned it in my open letter to
> Cacciari that Roberto [Scano] published here too (...) But it is true
> that common [run of the mill] accessibility culture concentrates on
> people in wheelchairs, and anyway the obstacles they face don't get
> eliminated either."  Yet as to digital accessibility, the "common
> culture" tends to focus only on visual obstacles...
> (5) Video (with captions and transcriptions in Italian and English) in
> <http://www.webmultimediale.org/videoblog/2008/08/venezia_ponte_di_calatrava_il.html>
> (6) The "egg-way" (ovovia)  "solution" is described further down in
> the transcript in
> <http://www.webmultimediale.org/videoblog/2008/08/venezia_ponte_di_calatrava_il.html>.
> Pictures of the ovovia project in
> <http://www.comune.venezia.it/flex/cm/pages/ServeBLOB.php/L/IT/IDPagina/3691>:
> apart from the fact it doesn't address the obstacles for low-sighted
> people,  if I were wheelchair-bound, I'd absolutely hate the idea of
> being imprisoned in a kind of UFO thing gliding outside the bridge on
> a single axis for several minutes - especially on a windy day.
>
> On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 4:39 PM, Jayne Cravens
> <jc at coyotecommunications.com> wrote:
>> Thanks to everyone who replied. Norbert Bollow <nb at Adaptux.com> wrote:
>>
>>>  >>I think this is a very important point:  Sometimes it takes only a
>>>very small amount of (wisely-directed) effort to achieve victories
>>>of local significance.  This is particularly significant given that
>>>such relatively small, local victories are an essential precondition
>>>for having any hope of any large-scale trend-setting breakthroughs.
>>>
>>>>>For example, I would suggest that in any and all informatics projects
>>>(not only web development, but also of purely internal informatics
>>>systems) the question should be raised whether accessibility concerns
>>>are taken into consideration, and if not, why not.
>>
>> This is a commitment I would like to see everyone make -- for every
>> online or tech-focused project you are on, ask, "Does this project
>> meet the standards promoted by W3C? Will this online tool be
>> accessible for someone who who has a sight-impairment? Someone with
>> hearing impairments? Someone with limited hand movement? Someone
>> using an assistive technology tool?"
>>
>> You will get a lot of arguments like "I don't think we serve that
>> many people who have disabilities" or "that would be too expensive."
>> You need to be prepared to address those arguments. Sites like
>> http://www.w3.org/ and http://www.knowbility.org can help. But if
>> just every person on the Digital Divide Network would ask those
>> questions for any tech project they were involved with right now and
>> in the future, commercial or nonprofit, imagine what an effect that
>> would have.
>>
>> --
>> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
>> Ms. Jayne Cravens MSc
>> Bonn, Germany
>>
>> http://www.coyotecommunications.com
>>
>> Volunteer Coordinator
>> http://www.aidworkers.net
>>
>> www.ivisit.com id: jcravens.4947
>> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Claude Almansi
> _______________________________________________
> DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.net with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.



-- 
Xavier Leonard
Heads On Fire :: Fab Lab
4305 University Avenue, Suite 130
San Diego, CA 92105
ph.:619.964.6522 fx.:954.208.9573
X.L at headsonfire.org http://www.headsonfire.org

"Change By Design"

From eorissa at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 21:05:09 2008
From: eorissa at gmail.com (Bijaya Satapathy)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 06:35:09 +0530
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
	<48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>
Message-ID: <6786bf10809031805w53df15efw17196dc3628c898b@mail.gmail.com>

Mobile phone now-a-days is the latest ICT gadgets that truly bridges the
digital divide in society.

The marvel of this product incorporated with IP-technology will let anyone
communicate in Data, Voice, Fax, Audio, Viodeo mode Freely across the world.

Thanking you,

B.K.Satapathy


On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Taran Rampersad <cnd at knowprose.com> wrote:

> I'm really feeling sorry for the dead horse I've been beating, but it
> seems it needs to run a few more laps. That would be mobile phone - the
> future of computing is being discussed on another email list I
> participate on with the changed context that the mobile phone brings.
>
> In essence, the PC doesn't really know it's dead yet - partly because it
> isn't dead *yet* and also because no one really seems to understand how
> the market is changing. The mobile phone has forever changed the
> landscape - even gaining special mention in the UNESCO report brought
> out this year. If anything, the mobile phone is accidentally closing the
> digital divide. After all, it's ubiquitous even in nations that are
> pretty good at avoiding change (i.e., the developing world).
>
> That said, I have yet to see how disseminating information on bed
> netting on the Internet helps with dengue and malaria - and the same
> applies to irrigation (which I have been doing myself lately). Bed
> netting is a fact of life that many people grow up with - the true
> problem is *affording* it. Irrigation is a common sense use of science
> which varies upon application, so it doesn't translate well to the web
> until you can upload topography and soil type data and assure that the
> results are near perfect.
>
> No, maybe simply participating in discussion is the first step. Thus,
> the mobile phone. The truth is that the developing world doesn't need
> PCs as much as it needs better mobile phones and telecommunications
> regulation. Importing PCs into developing nations that have no legal or
> other infrastructure for disposal only pollutes developing nations that
> need the very fertile soil that is being polluted. The same applies to
> mobile phones as well, unfortunately.
>
> What we need to do, IMHO, is stop playing with the tiger's tail if we
> have no plans for dealing with the teeth.
>
> Steve Eskow wrote:
> > Is it the hardware and software divide that is our central concern here,
> our
> > goal to get as many computer per capita over there as we have here? Or is
> > our goal the information and knowledge divide, with the computer the
> > intermediary that gets the information about irrigation and bed netting
>  and
> > the alternatives to kerosene lighting to the people who need it?
> >
> > If it's the latter, we might aim to get one computer to a poor rural
> > village, train one literate person in its use, and have him or her get
> the
> > information about irrigation and kerosene and bed netting to the people
> who
> > need it, perhaps using community radio as the disseminator.
> >
> > Is that one way of easing the "digital divide"?
> >
> > Steve Eskow
> >
> --
> Taran Rampersad
> cnd at knowprose.com
>
> http://www.knowprose.com
> http://www.your2ndplace.com
> http://www.opendepth.com
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/
>
> "Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
> "The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." -
> Nikola Tesla
>
> _______________________________________________
> DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.netwith the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
>



-- 
e-Orissa
Bhubaneswar,India.
Cell:91-9861128546

From jpoteau at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 23:31:29 2008
From: jpoteau at gmail.com (Jacky)
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 23:31:29 -0400
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <6786bf10809031805w53df15efw17196dc3628c898b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
	<48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>
	<6786bf10809031805w53df15efw17196dc3628c898b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2e87063f0809032031m7b95aa78t9c535c16c5d57579@mail.gmail.com>

I agree with the idea that mobile phone is the latest ICT gadget; however,
there is a lot that remains to be done in terms of broadband penetration.

Jacky Poteau
Haiti

On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 9:05 PM, Bijaya Satapathy <eorissa at gmail.com> wrote:

> Mobile phone now-a-days is the latest ICT gadgets that truly bridges the
> digital divide in society.
>
> The marvel of this product incorporated with IP-technology will let anyone
> communicate in Data, Voice, Fax, Audio, Viodeo mode Freely across the
> world.
>
> Thanking you,
>
> B.K.Satapathy
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Taran Rampersad <cnd at knowprose.com> wrote:
>
> > I'm really feeling sorry for the dead horse I've been beating, but it
> > seems it needs to run a few more laps. That would be mobile phone - the
> > future of computing is being discussed on another email list I
> > participate on with the changed context that the mobile phone brings.
> >
> > In essence, the PC doesn't really know it's dead yet - partly because it
> > isn't dead *yet* and also because no one really seems to understand how
> > the market is changing. The mobile phone has forever changed the
> > landscape - even gaining special mention in the UNESCO report brought
> > out this year. If anything, the mobile phone is accidentally closing the
> > digital divide. After all, it's ubiquitous even in nations that are
> > pretty good at avoiding change (i.e., the developing world).
> >
> > That said, I have yet to see how disseminating information on bed
> > netting on the Internet helps with dengue and malaria - and the same
> > applies to irrigation (which I have been doing myself lately). Bed
> > netting is a fact of life that many people grow up with - the true
> > problem is *affording* it. Irrigation is a common sense use of science
> > which varies upon application, so it doesn't translate well to the web
> > until you can upload topography and soil type data and assure that the
> > results are near perfect.
> >
> > No, maybe simply participating in discussion is the first step. Thus,
> > the mobile phone. The truth is that the developing world doesn't need
> > PCs as much as it needs better mobile phones and telecommunications
> > regulation. Importing PCs into developing nations that have no legal or
> > other infrastructure for disposal only pollutes developing nations that
> > need the very fertile soil that is being polluted. The same applies to
> > mobile phones as well, unfortunately.
> >
> > What we need to do, IMHO, is stop playing with the tiger's tail if we
> > have no plans for dealing with the teeth.
> >
> > Steve Eskow wrote:
> > > Is it the hardware and software divide that is our central concern
> here,
> > our
> > > goal to get as many computer per capita over there as we have here? Or
> is
> > > our goal the information and knowledge divide, with the computer the
> > > intermediary that gets the information about irrigation and bed netting
> >  and
> > > the alternatives to kerosene lighting to the people who need it?
> > >
> > > If it's the latter, we might aim to get one computer to a poor rural
> > > village, train one literate person in its use, and have him or her get
> > the
> > > information about irrigation and kerosene and bed netting to the people
> > who
> > > need it, perhaps using community radio as the disseminator.
> > >
> > > Is that one way of easing the "digital divide"?
> > >
> > > Steve Eskow
> > >
> > --
> > Taran Rampersad
> > cnd at knowprose.com
> >
> > http://www.knowprose.com
> > http://www.your2ndplace.com
> > http://www.opendepth.com
> > http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/
> >
> > "Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
> > "The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine."
> -
> > Nikola Tesla
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> > DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> > http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> > To unsubscribe, send a message to
> digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.netwith the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the
> body of the message.
> >
>
>
>
> --
> e-Orissa
> Bhubaneswar,India.
> Cell:91-9861128546
> _______________________________________________
> DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.netwith the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
>



-- 
Jacky Poteau, MSW, MCP
President, FATEM
www.fatem.org
Voicemail: 1-866-98-FATEM (983-2836)
Skype name: jackypoteau

From cnd at knowprose.com  Thu Sep  4 00:16:14 2008
From: cnd at knowprose.com (Taran Rampersad)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 00:16:14 -0400
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <2e87063f0809032031m7b95aa78t9c535c16c5d57579@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>	<48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>	<6786bf10809031805w53df15efw17196dc3628c898b@mail.gmail.com>
	<2e87063f0809032031m7b95aa78t9c535c16c5d57579@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48BF610E.6040200@knowprose.com>

I agree, Jacky, but the problem of broadband penetration is a matter of 
cost and telecommunications regulation. This has been mentioned more 
than once at the CARICOM Internet Governance meetings, as an example - 
meanwhile the mobile phone subverts this by allowing voice and text 
communication as well as, in some cases, internet access.

At the end of the day, it isn't about gadgets. It's about policy and costs.

(As a subnote - good to see someone from Haiti here!)

Jacky wrote:
> I agree with the idea that mobile phone is the latest ICT gadget; however,
> there is a lot that remains to be done in terms of broadband penetration.
>
> Jacky Poteau
> Haiti
>   
--
Taran Rampersad
cnd at knowprose.com

http://www.knowprose.com
http://www.your2ndplace.com
http://www.opendepth.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/

"Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
"The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." - Nikola Tesla


From chris at aptivate.org  Thu Sep  4 05:04:23 2008
From: chris at aptivate.org (Chris Wilson)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 10:04:23 +0100 (BST)
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <BAY108-W523B60B1A29B48FC5F5014A75F0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY108-W523B60B1A29B48FC5F5014A75F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.1.00.0809040957420.24580@fen-ndiyo1.fen.aptivate.org>

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the very interesting and insightful post. I agree with most of 
what you wrote and will spare everyone the bandwidth of reposting that 
which I agree with. However, a few questions:

On Tue, 2 Sep 2008, tom abeles wrote:

> And, therein lies one of the problems in today's world where we expect 
> the dark to be dispersed with the flick of a switch.
[...]
> It is also why we default to technology.

It seems to me that technology by itself does not solve these problems. In 
fact, perhaps it creates them by creating the expectation of instant 
solutions that often cannot be satisfied.

Does anyone believe that it is possible to "fix" the digital divide, or 
that a particular combination of tools and technologies can do so? How is 
it different to the "Mercedes divide" or the "clean water divide"?

> I have seen families emotionally torn because they want their children 
> to learn but if they are in school they can't work and work means food 
> on the table for the entire family. OLPC?  Some folks, putting their 
> kids to work, are committing the ultimate sacrifice of eating their seed 
> potatoes.

It is a sacrifice, but if the family dies from hunger today then the seed 
potatoes will go uneaten and unplanted. Life is full of compromises. What 
does this have to do with technology and quick fixes?

> The metonymic "digital divide" represents that mythical armamentarium 
> equivalent to Batman's tool belt or some pharmaceutical formulary, more 
> a mix of paliatives and placibos to avoid having to deal with the core 
> problems facing humans ever since Adam bit into the apple of knowledge.

Sorry, I don't see how labelling part of the situation as "the problem" 
(the digital divide) equates to labelling part of a situation as a 
solution (Batman's tool belt) except in that both labels are useful 
learning tools (training wheels) for understanding the situation but fail 
to capture the entire reality. If that was not your point, please could 
you explain further?

Cheers, Chris.
-- 
Aptivate | http://www.aptivate.org | Phone: +44 1223 760887
The Humanitarian Centre, Fenner's, Gresham Road, Cambridge CB1 2ES

Aptivate is a not-for-profit company registered in England and Wales
with company number 04980791.


From chris at aptivate.org  Thu Sep  4 05:15:35 2008
From: chris at aptivate.org (Chris Wilson)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 10:15:35 +0100 (BST)
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
	<48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.1.00.0809041004280.24580@fen-ndiyo1.fen.aptivate.org>

Hi Taran,

On Tue, 2 Sep 2008, Taran Rampersad wrote:

> I'm really feeling sorry for the dead horse I've been beating, but it 
> seems it needs to run a few more laps.

Thanks, that made me laugh a lot :-)

> That would be mobile phone - the future of computing is being discussed 
> on another email list I participate on with the changed context that the 
> mobile phone brings.
> 
> In essence, the PC doesn't really know it's dead yet - partly because it 
> isn't dead *yet* and also because no one really seems to understand how 
> the market is changing.

I don't agree that the mobile phone has killed the PC. They are used for 
very different things. Can you see a businessman tracking his stock or 
calculating optimal market strategies using databases and spreadsheets on 
a mobile, or a student reading or writing textbooks and essays on one?

We may see convergence, we may see divergence, we will certainly see 
adaptation to niches, but I don't believe that the mobile phone is the 
answer to the world's problems any more than the PC is.

> The mobile phone has forever changed the landscape - even gaining 
> special mention in the UNESCO report brought out this year. If anything, 
> the mobile phone is accidentally closing the digital divide. After all, 
> it's ubiquitous even in nations that are pretty good at avoiding change 
> (i.e., the developing world).

It's becoming ubiquitous in nations that are bad at paying for technology, 
that much I agree with.

> Bed netting is a fact of life that many people grow up with - the true 
> problem is *affording* it. Irrigation is a common sense use of science 
> which varies upon application, so it doesn't translate well to the web 
> until you can upload topography and soil type data and assure that the 
> results are near perfect.

I think that the internet is a digital analogy to irrigation. It makes 
other pieces of technology (fields vs computers) more effective and 
useful.

> No, maybe simply participating in discussion is the first step. Thus, 
> the mobile phone.

It is an important step, but not the first (that is the willingness to 
participate in discussion) or the second (that is the ability to afford to 
participate in discussion), and no more than an accessory to the steps 
that follow (that is turning discussion into action and change).

> The truth is that the developing world doesn't need PCs as much as it 
> needs better mobile phones and telecommunications regulation.

True, but it does need them.

> Importing PCs into developing nations that have no legal or other 
> infrastructure for disposal only pollutes developing nations that need 
> the very fertile soil that is being polluted.

No, they have a useful function when used correctly. The important thing 
is to import working equipment and place it in situations where it can and 
will be used for real benefit, and sustainably.

> The same applies to mobile phones as well, unfortunately.

But not quite in the same way, because I don't think phones are dumped on 
developing countries in the way that PCs are, so there is one less hidden 
agenda in exporting them.

> What we need to do, IMHO, is stop playing with the tiger's tail if we 
> have no plans for dealing with the teeth.

Is this a warning about e-waste, PCs vs mobiles, empowerment of developing 
countries or general feline policy?

Cheers, Chris.
-- 
Aptivate | http://www.aptivate.org | Phone: +44 1223 760887
The Humanitarian Centre, Fenner's, Gresham Road, Cambridge CB1 2ES

Aptivate is a not-for-profit company registered in England and Wales
with company number 04980791.


From chris at aptivate.org  Thu Sep  4 05:35:51 2008
From: chris at aptivate.org (Chris Wilson)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 10:35:51 +0100 (BST)
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <d9d15ba30809031132k24402e45id8f8d6f28679517e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY108-W523B60B1A29B48FC5F5014A75F0@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30809031132k24402e45id8f8d6f28679517e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.1.00.0809041034370.24580@fen-ndiyo1.fen.aptivate.org>

Hi Steve,

On Wed, 3 Sep 2008, Steve Eskow wrote:

> The "divide" is part of a larger "situation." If technology enthusiasts 
> haven't the patience and the skill to study and take into account the 
> larger situation which will surround a new technology, they can do more 
> harm than good.

What techniques and tools do you find useful in studying the situation and 
adapting the solution to it?

Cheers, Chris.
-- 
Aptivate | http://www.aptivate.org | Phone: +44 1223 760887
The Humanitarian Centre, Fenner's, Gresham Road, Cambridge CB1 2ES

Aptivate is a not-for-profit company registered in England and Wales
with company number 04980791.

From jpoteau at gmail.com  Thu Sep  4 06:32:16 2008
From: jpoteau at gmail.com (Jacky)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 06:32:16 -0400
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <48BF610E.6040200@knowprose.com>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>
	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>
	<48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>
	<6786bf10809031805w53df15efw17196dc3628c898b@mail.gmail.com>
	<2e87063f0809032031m7b95aa78t9c535c16c5d57579@mail.gmail.com>
	<48BF610E.6040200@knowprose.com>
Message-ID: <2e87063f0809040332m6729188bj57f861ca3b3eba81@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for your hospitality, Taran!

On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 12:16 AM, Taran Rampersad <cnd at knowprose.com> wrote:

> I agree, Jacky, but the problem of broadband penetration is a matter of
> cost and telecommunications regulation. This has been mentioned more
> than once at the CARICOM Internet Governance meetings, as an example -
> meanwhile the mobile phone subverts this by allowing voice and text
> communication as well as, in some cases, internet access.
>
> At the end of the day, it isn't about gadgets. It's about policy and costs.
>
> (As a subnote - good to see someone from Haiti here!)
>
> Jacky wrote:
> > I agree with the idea that mobile phone is the latest ICT gadget;
> however,
> > there is a lot that remains to be done in terms of broadband penetration.
> >
> > Jacky Poteau
> > Haiti
> >
> --
> Taran Rampersad
> cnd at knowprose.com
>
> http://www.knowprose.com
> http://www.your2ndplace.com
> http://www.opendepth.com
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/
>
> "Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
> "The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." -
> Nikola Tesla
>
> _______________________________________________
> DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
>  To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.netwith the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
>



-- 
Jacky Poteau, MSW, MCP
President, FATEM
www.fatem.org
Voicemail: 1-866-98-FATEM (983-2836)
Skype name: jackypoteau

From nb at bollow.ch  Thu Sep  4 06:01:54 2008
From: nb at bollow.ch (Norbert Bollow)
Date: Thu,  4 Sep 2008 12:01:54 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: [DDN] Fwd: Web 2.0 leaves out people with disabilities
In-Reply-To: <4ea9ca300809031302g2b6c3235ubb3082816e9af742@mail.gmail.com>
	(X.L@headsonfire.org)
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>
	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>
	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460808220911r553780a2pbf5fee1582cde6ec@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080823113104.5188A220248@quill.bollow.ch>
	<a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
	<4ea9ca300809031302g2b6c3235ubb3082816e9af742@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080904100154.C59F84E8001@quill.bollow.ch>

Xavier Leonard <X.L at headsonfire.org> wrote:

> many web 2.0 technologies employ xml >>  xml evolved from  sgml >>
> one Charles Goldfarb's main motivations for developing sgml was to
> make books more accessible to people with visual disabilities.

If this information is accurate, I'd be very interested in having
a quotable source for this...

> a little more about this (very little, unfortunately) can be found in
> this Goldfarb bio: http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/CGbioFull.htm

Alas, this document does not contain the assertion about accessibilty
work being one of the driving motivations in the development of SGML.
(It only mentions making "more information accessible to people with
reading disabilities" as an _effect_ of "the widespread deployment of
markup languages".)

Based on the interviews on the same site, I'm coming to the conclusion
that while work on an SGML-based accessibility project turned out to
be from Goldfarb's personal perspective "the most rewarding markup project"
that he had ever been involved in [1], this application area was not in
fact the original motivation for the development of GML and SGML.  At
least, when asked about the original motivations for these developments,
he didn't mention accessibility aspects:

In [2]:

Q: Dr. Goldfarb, you led the project at IBM that invented SGML's
   precursor, GML. It's said that necessity is the mother of
   invention. What specific problem were you trying to solve?

A: We were trying to do an automated law-office application. I had
   been a lawyer (in fact, I still am). Lawyers must do research on
   existing case law, decisions of court, and so on, to find out which
   ones are applicable to a given situation, find out what the previous
   legal rulings have been, and then merge that with text that the lawyer
   has written himself. Eventually, if it's, say, a brief for the court,
   [he must] then compose it and print it. At the time, which was 1969 or
   1970, there weren't any systems available that did these three
   things. So in order to get the systems to share the data we had to
   come up with a way to represent it that was independent of any of
   those applications.


In [3]:

Q: How did you get started with SGML?

A: After Ed Mosher and Ray Lorie and I completed our GML project, I
   decided to pursue some of the ideas further. I felt that a DTD could
   be created in a form that computers could read, and therefore be able
   to validate markup without actually processing the document. I proved
   it in 1974, so I consider that the start of SGML. Of course, it took
   another decade -- and hundreds of talented people -- to develop it
   into an International Standard.

[1] http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/Losi.htm
[2] http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/Floyd1.htm
[3] http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/Kennedy.htm


Greetings,
Norbert

-- 
Norbert Bollow <nb at Adaptux.com>
Informatics Management and Consulting for Adaptability and Benefit/Cost
Optimization in Harmony with Human Rights and Needs

From nb at bollow.ch  Thu Sep  4 08:09:13 2008
From: nb at bollow.ch (Norbert Bollow)
Date: Thu,  4 Sep 2008 14:09:13 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: [DDN] universal design (was: Web 2.0 leaves out people..)
In-Reply-To: <bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
	(claude.almansi@gmail.com)
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>
	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>
	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460808220911r553780a2pbf5fee1582cde6ec@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080823113104.5188A220248@quill.bollow.ch>
	<a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080904120913.58DC14E8001@quill.bollow.ch>

Claude Almansi <claude.almansi at gmail.com> wrote:

> About universal design: an interesting collaboration between advocates
> of universal design for both real-life and online accessibility has
> started in Italy in the last week
[..]
> "some analogies can be seen, if you have been dealing with these
> issues for some years, be it on the Web or in the physical world:
> there are analogies between architectural and digital obstacles. There
> are also analogies in the ways problems get solved, and in the defects
> in these attempts to solve problems. One immediately obvious example
> is the fact that the best, most efficient way to produce a work -- be
> it a Web video or site, or be it a bridge or a work of architecture --
> a work that is is harmonious, complete and doesn't discriminate
> anyone.
> This way is accessible planning, i.e. a planning that keeps
> accessibility in mind and respects the principles of "Design for all".
> (...) this analogy between both worlds is confirmed by the fact that
> an a posteriori adaptation, as the "egg-way" (6) in the case of
> Calatrava's bridge, produces two parallel worlds but does not unite
> them -- just as with parallel Web sites made to offer an alternative
> path for people with disabilities. How often have we chanced upon
> alternative Web sites that ask the user: "Are you are you non-disabled
> or non-seeing?", and if the person answers: "I'm non-seeing", she or
> he gets invited to a different viewing, to a different path from the
> one used by seeing people."

Hmmm... there are also other forms of discrimination against
minorities which involve closely related economic mechanisms:

- discrimination against developers and users of minority computer
  operating systems through use of patented or otherwise restricted
  proprietary data formats

- discrimination against people who for whatever reason want or
  need to avoid indiscriminately leaking personal information
  over the internet

- discrimination against people who for whatever reason have only
  slow and/or expensive access to the internet, or who are only
  able to conveneinetly access the internet via a device with a very
  small screen, such as a mobile phone.  (In absolute numbers, this
  is probably currently actually a majority, but from the perspective
  of many websites, this is a very small minority of their users,
  therefore the same economic mechanisms apply.)

Claude, is the "universal design" collaboration which you describe
defined so generally as to also encompass these aspects of
universality of design which are not directly related to disabilities?

If yes, I think I'll probably be looking into whether there'd be some
mutually beneficial way in which I could join in into that "universal
design" alliance... and if not, I'd be interested in discussing
whether it would make sense to attempt to initiate a more broadly
defined alliance.

Greetings,
Norbert.


-- 
Norbert Bollow <nb at Adaptux.com>
Informatics Management and Consulting for Adaptability and Benefit/Cost
Optimization in Harmony with Human Rights and Needs

From claude.almansi at gmail.com  Thu Sep  4 08:55:04 2008
From: claude.almansi at gmail.com (Claude Almansi)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 14:55:04 +0200
Subject: [DDN] universal design (was: Web 2.0 leaves out people..)
In-Reply-To: <20080904120913.58DC14E8001@quill.bollow.ch>
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>
	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>
	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460808220911r553780a2pbf5fee1582cde6ec@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080823113104.5188A220248@quill.bollow.ch>
	<a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080904120913.58DC14E8001@quill.bollow.ch>
Message-ID: <bb3c31460809040555n4c4a8f2au765bd66231528ad9@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Norbert and All

Norbert, I am no way a specialist of universal design - I don't
design, let alone universally - so I hope others will answer your
question as to its use for fighting the discriminations you list
below. Tentatively, between your items:

On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Norbert Bollow <nb at bollow.ch> wrote:
>(...)
>
> Hmmm... there are also other forms of discrimination against
> minorities which involve closely related economic mechanisms:
>
> - discrimination against developers and users of minority computer
>  operating systems through use of patented or otherwise restricted
>  proprietary data formats

UD probably can counter that through being in the end more
attractive/competitive than these restricted formats. See MS
acknowledging that ODF has  won at the Red Hat Summit in June ("Red
Hat Summit panel: Who 'won' OOXML battle?"
<http://www.thestandard.com/news/2008/06/19/red-hat-summit-panel-who-won-ooxml-battle>).
Or did I misunderstand your question.
>
> - discrimination against people who for whatever reason want or
>  need to avoid indiscriminately leaking personal information
>  over the internet

UD probably doesn't help there, as far as I can understand: thinking
of the various Google offers that could be described as fitting UD
definition, but bank on folks accepting to trade in part of their
privacy.

>
> - discrimination against people who for whatever reason have only
>  slow and/or expensive access to the internet, or who are only
>  able to conveneinetly access the internet via a device with a very
>  small screen, such as a mobile phone.  (In absolute numbers, this
>  is probably currently actually a majority, but from the perspective
>  of many websites, this is a very small minority of their users,
>  therefore the same economic mechanisms apply.)

UD can help there, I believe: accessible sites made according to UD
principles also load faster and also work better on the devices you
mention - besides, Roberto Ellero, whom I mentioned as advocate of UD
in my former post, lives in a part of Italy where the only internet
access on a computer so far is 56 kb/s ("when the wind is blowing from
the right direction", adds a friend of mine who lives in a similar
area, access-wise) and is still able to manage the webmultimediale.org
site under these conditions ;-)
>
> Claude, is the "universal design" collaboration which you describe
> defined so generally as to also encompass these aspects of
> universality of design which are not directly related to disabilities

It is defined far more generally than for just access for disabled
people. But - see above - it does not, as far as I know, encompass the
privacy issue.
>
> If yes, I think I'll probably be looking into whether there'd be some
> mutually beneficial way in which I could join in into that "universal
> design" alliance... and if not, I'd be interested in discussing
> whether it would make sense to attempt to initiate a more broadly
> defined alliance.

Not sure about an existing single UD alliance: for the Web, there is
IWA iwanet.org, but you also have architects and engineers advocating
UD: see for instance Fred Tepfer, architect and planner, who works at
the University of Oregon <http://www.uoregon.edu/~ftepfer/index.html>,
 whose <http://www.uoregon.edu/~ftepfer/SchlFacilities/TireSwingTable.html>
page with the "tire swing cartoon" I adapted in
<http://www.webmultimediale.org/almansi/2008/09/il_ponte_luovo_e_il_dondolo.html>.

And that was Roberto Ellero's point in his video: the coming together
of UD advocates both in the real world and the online world about the
obstacles of Calatrava's bridge.  (BTW, just as inaccessible sites are
a pain for people with slow connection or handheld devices, the bridge
obstacles do not only hamper people in wheelchairs, but also parents
with a pram or carting things with something that has wheels).

So I don't know whether such a unique general alliance between
advocates of UD in all fields will come to light, but it is a good
sign that in Italy, they've started collaborating.

Best

Claude Almansi

From cnd at knowprose.com  Thu Sep  4 09:37:20 2008
From: cnd at knowprose.com (Taran Rampersad)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 09:37:20 -0400
Subject: [DDN] Google Insights - social networking
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.1.00.0809041004280.24580@fen-ndiyo1.fen.aptivate.org>
References: <BAY108-W3D75ADDB712F32391DB15A7650@phx.gbl>	<d9d15ba30808230949x6051540cye9582c14325215b8@mail.gmail.com>	<48BD3DB2.5030600@knowprose.com>
	<alpine.DEB.1.00.0809041004280.24580@fen-ndiyo1.fen.aptivate.org>
Message-ID: <48BFE490.5000307@knowprose.com>

Chris Wilson wrote:
>> That would be mobile phone - the future of computing is being discussed 
>> on another email list I participate on with the changed context that the 
>> mobile phone brings.
>>
>> In essence, the PC doesn't really know it's dead yet - partly because it 
>> isn't dead *yet* and also because no one really seems to understand how 
>> the market is changing.
>>     
>
> I don't agree that the mobile phone has killed the PC. They are used for 
> very different things. Can you see a businessman tracking his stock or 
> calculating optimal market strategies using databases and spreadsheets on 
> a mobile, or a student reading or writing textbooks and essays on one?
>   
I'd say you'll see this within the next 5 years due to the following:

(1) Improved hardware.
(2) Improved software.

The stepping stones are video and input. But let's take stock: no one 
ever thought text messages would be such a big deal despite the awkward 
keyboard on a mobile phone. But there it is.
The video and input can be solved with output jacks for monitors and 
keyboards. At the end of the day, mobile phones are all over. PCs are 
not. Mobile phones have more computing power than the first PCs right 
now. PCs are heavier to ship (a large factor).
> We may see convergence, we may see divergence, we will certainly see 
> adaptation to niches, but I don't believe that the mobile phone is the 
> answer to the world's problems any more than the PC is.
>   
No, the answer to the world's problems remains geopolitical despite how 
flat Friedman thinks the Earth is. ;-)
>> The mobile phone has forever changed the landscape - even gaining 
>> special mention in the UNESCO report brought out this year. If anything, 
>> the mobile phone is accidentally closing the digital divide. After all, 
>> it's ubiquitous even in nations that are pretty good at avoiding change 
>> (i.e., the developing world).
>>     
>
> It's becoming ubiquitous in nations that are bad at paying for technology, 
> that much I agree with.
>   
I think that it would be more fair to say that some nations simply do 
not allow for rapid adoption by *governments*.
>   
>> Bed netting is a fact of life that many people grow up with - the true 
>> problem is *affording* it. Irrigation is a common sense use of science 
>> which varies upon application, so it doesn't translate well to the web 
>> until you can upload topography and soil type data and assure that the 
>> results are near perfect.
>>     
>
> I think that the internet is a digital analogy to irrigation. It makes 
> other pieces of technology (fields vs computers) more effective and 
> useful.
>   
I think the Internet offers the potential for making things more 
effective and useful. Even so, we're looking at 20% Internet penetration 
- which means that the number of people offline is roughly equivalent to 
the world population of 1995.
>> No, maybe simply participating in discussion is the first step. Thus, 
>> the mobile phone.
>>     
>
> It is an important step, but not the first (that is the willingness to 
> participate in discussion) or the second (that is the ability to afford to 
> participate in discussion), and no more than an accessory to the steps 
> that follow (that is turning discussion into action and change).
>   
I respectfully disagree. One must know that there is a discussion before 
one can participate, and thus one has to fall into the discussion 
somewhere along the line. :-)
>> The truth is that the developing world doesn't need PCs as much as it 
>> needs better mobile phones and telecommunications regulation.
>>     
>
> True, but it does need them.
>   
That may be so, but the *how* and *why* vary according to population, 
socioeconomic conditions and a variety of other reasons. Sure, I'd like 
to see more tech in agriculture (since this is what I'm doing these 
days) but at the end of the day, people don't need a PC as much as they 
need a piece of technology that makes their jobs easier. The mobile 
phone is actually much more useful and versatile to farmers than a PC. 
Calculator, communication and even a few games to kill time.
>> Importing PCs into developing nations that have no legal or other 
>> infrastructure for disposal only pollutes developing nations that need 
>> the very fertile soil that is being polluted.
>>     
>
> No, they have a useful function when used correctly. The important thing 
> is to import working equipment and place it in situations where it can and 
> will be used for real benefit, and sustainably.
>   
And I offer that this has been what many have said for decades, and yet...
>> The same applies to mobile phones as well, unfortunately.
>>     
>
> But not quite in the same way, because I don't think phones are dumped on 
> developing countries in the way that PCs are, so there is one less hidden 
> agenda in exporting them.
>   
They are dumped. Where else do people throw them?
>> What we need to do, IMHO, is stop playing with the tiger's tail if we 
>> have no plans for dealing with the teeth.
>>     
>
> Is this a warning about e-waste, PCs vs mobiles, empowerment of developing 
> countries or general feline policy?
>   
It's not a warning. It is an observation, and that observation does fit 
well with all of the above. People like to play with the furry tail. 
People like to ignore the sharp pointy teeth.

Corporations have it easier - markets are, at the least, 
pseudo-democracies. But the digital divide is about more than that, and 
because many people - the vast majority - affected by the digital divide 
do not have a say due to insufficient finance or poor policy - are not 
involved in corporate markets. This leads to what we are discussing 
here. Understanding that at the core is important, because marketing 
tactics by corporations aren't about ubiquity of access but instead 
making money. It's not bad, but it doesn't help - and often has to be 
subverted for people to realize that there is a market. The mobile phone 
has done just that, and will continue to do so.

Why? Because even the corporations see a market where there was not one 
before. Now the infrastructure is needed. But there are lots of people 
out there who think that one can make technology useful without proper 
infrastructure. And infrastructure includes telecom pricing, policy, 
ewaste, software licensing, content licensing and much more.

-- 
--
Taran Rampersad
cnd at knowprose.com

http://www.knowprose.com
http://www.your2ndplace.com
http://www.opendepth.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/

"Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
"The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." - Nikola Tesla


From elandero at gmu.edu  Thu Sep  4 10:28:34 2008
From: elandero at gmu.edu (Estella C Landeros)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 10:28:34 -0400
Subject: [DDN] Support for deaf professionals on the job
Message-ID: <f674a5b61dc45.48bfb852@gmu.edu>

Would anybody have some information on companies offering video-conferencing systems accessible for deaf people?  Most current products do not allow for deaf people to do lip reading and/or clearly see other people signing due to the low number of frames per second those products allow.

I have been told that most companies only use 25 or less frames per second. For a deaf person to do lip reading on a video it has to be something at least 30 frames per second or higher resolution.
Any ideas?
Thanks and regards,
Estela

Estela Landeros-Dugourd
Assistive Technology Coordinator
T/TAC George Mason University
Kellar Institute for Human disAbilities
Ph. 703-993-4496 Fax 703-993-4497
www.ttaconline.org
http://ttac.gmu.edu




From magda_pischetola at yahoo.it  Thu Sep  4 11:12:44 2008
From: magda_pischetola at yahoo.it (Magda Pischetola)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 15:12:44 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: [DDN] PhD research on OLPC
In-Reply-To: <a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@[10.0.1.2]>
Message-ID: <86879.20343.qm@web23708.mail.ird.yahoo.com>

Dear collegues,
?
I've been?reading with great interests your posts in the latest months and now I'd like you to ask your opinion about a topic that is going to be an important?part of my?research.
?
I am doing my?PhD?in Italy with a project on the Digital divide from the point of view of Education. I am?studying?how can education reduce the DD with media literacy and how teachers can help children to achieve a?good level of the so-called "digital skills", to access ICT and Internet and to produce development.
?
Now,?this year I will follow a field research?in a?primary school where teachers are going to introduce?the OLPC?laptop as a tool?in their method of theaching. Then, in the new year I'd like to compare the results?to another area of the world (I'm thinking of Buenos Ayres, Argentina).
?
I'm asking to you all what you think - out of any preconcept that I might share - about the initiative of OLPC in the world (if it is a goof initiave or not and why) and?which aspect would?you stress in a field research like this one (e.g. skills of the teacher, self-learning of the child, creativity?and?flexibility of the project, etc.).
?
I will appreciate?very much?your help.
Thank you!
?
Magda Pischetola

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Poco spazio e tanto spam? Yahoo! Mail ti protegge dallo spam e ti da tanto spazio gratuito per i tuoi file e i messaggi 
http://mail.yahoo.it 

From X.L at headsonfire.org  Thu Sep  4 18:13:02 2008
From: X.L at headsonfire.org (Xavier Leonard)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 15:13:02 -0700
Subject: [DDN] Fwd: Web 2.0 leaves out people with disabilities
In-Reply-To: <20080904100154.C59F84E8001@quill.bollow.ch>
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>
	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>
	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460808220911r553780a2pbf5fee1582cde6ec@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080823113104.5188A220248@quill.bollow.ch>
	<a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
	<4ea9ca300809031302g2b6c3235ubb3082816e9af742@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080904100154.C59F84E8001@quill.bollow.ch>
Message-ID: <4ea9ca300809041513j4c895703pacf9f6cf52e0996d@mail.gmail.com>

Those are good points. I may have made too strong of a connection
between Goldfarb's intentions and the intentions of Yuri Rubinsky.
The two did work closely together and you can get a sense of the ideas
they shared about sgml in this tribute that Goldfarb wrote:
http://xml.coverpages.org/yuriMemGoldfarb.html

On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 3:01 AM, Norbert Bollow <nb at bollow.ch> wrote:
> Xavier Leonard <X.L at headsonfire.org> wrote:
>
>> many web 2.0 technologies employ xml >>  xml evolved from  sgml >>
>> one Charles Goldfarb's main motivations for developing sgml was to
>> make books more accessible to people with visual disabilities.
>
> If this information is accurate, I'd be very interested in having
> a quotable source for this...
>
>> a little more about this (very little, unfortunately) can be found in
>> this Goldfarb bio: http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/CGbioFull.htm
>
> Alas, this document does not contain the assertion about accessibilty
> work being one of the driving motivations in the development of SGML.
> (It only mentions making "more information accessible to people with
> reading disabilities" as an _effect_ of "the widespread deployment of
> markup languages".)
>
> Based on the interviews on the same site, I'm coming to the conclusion
> that while work on an SGML-based accessibility project turned out to
> be from Goldfarb's personal perspective "the most rewarding markup project"
> that he had ever been involved in [1], this application area was not in
> fact the original motivation for the development of GML and SGML.  At
> least, when asked about the original motivations for these developments,
> he didn't mention accessibility aspects:
>
> In [2]:
>
> Q: Dr. Goldfarb, you led the project at IBM that invented SGML's
>   precursor, GML. It's said that necessity is the mother of
>   invention. What specific problem were you trying to solve?
>
> A: We were trying to do an automated law-office application. I had
>   been a lawyer (in fact, I still am). Lawyers must do research on
>   existing case law, decisions of court, and so on, to find out which
>   ones are applicable to a given situation, find out what the previous
>   legal rulings have been, and then merge that with text that the lawyer
>   has written himself. Eventually, if it's, say, a brief for the court,
>   [he must] then compose it and print it. At the time, which was 1969 or
>   1970, there weren't any systems available that did these three
>   things. So in order to get the systems to share the data we had to
>   come up with a way to represent it that was independent of any of
>   those applications.
>
>
> In [3]:
>
> Q: How did you get started with SGML?
>
> A: After Ed Mosher and Ray Lorie and I completed our GML project, I
>   decided to pursue some of the ideas further. I felt that a DTD could
>   be created in a form that computers could read, and therefore be able
>   to validate markup without actually processing the document. I proved
>   it in 1974, so I consider that the start of SGML. Of course, it took
>   another decade -- and hundreds of talented people -- to develop it
>   into an International Standard.
>
> [1] http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/Losi.htm
> [2] http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/Floyd1.htm
> [3] http://www.sgmlsource.com/press/Kennedy.htm
>
>
> Greetings,
> Norbert
>
> --
> Norbert Bollow <nb at Adaptux.com>
> Informatics Management and Consulting for Adaptability and Benefit/Cost
> Optimization in Harmony with Human Rights and Needs
> _______________________________________________
> DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.net with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
>



-- 
Xavier Leonard
Heads On Fire :: Fab Lab
4305 University Avenue, Suite 130
San Diego, CA 92105
ph.:619.964.6522 fx.:954.208.9573
X.L at headsonfire.org http://www.headsonfire.org

"Change By Design"

From johndenny at alumni.usc.edu  Fri Sep  5 03:26:15 2008
From: johndenny at alumni.usc.edu (JTD)
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 14:26:15 +0700
Subject: [DDN] PhD research on OLPC
In-Reply-To: <86879.20343.qm@web23708.mail.ird.yahoo.com>
References: <a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
	<86879.20343.qm@web23708.mail.ird.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <22bb86510809050026r5875b3d8o2f327bbafa64582@mail.gmail.com>

Magda

Brilliant...   I  love what you are doing...  I am sort of envious as there
are so many wonderful issues to research that I did not think of when I did
my doctoral work..

Anyhow...   on to your topic...

there was a time when I was not a believer of  OLPC... yet I am enlightened
now after viewing OLPC from an education perspective.

you ask for opinions...   yes it is an amazing initiative...  there have
been various computer projects that have brought to light the need for low
power devices that are appropriate for emerging markets, yet it is probably
OLPC that has opened more disruptive discussion on deployment in the largely
ignored segment of those who cannot afford mainstream technology at
developed world prices.

Yet the real importance is that OLPC is not about the technology... sure  it
brings amazing technology to light... but lift the sheets and you will see
it is about changing the way we teach and learn...  in my personal opinion
it is about thinking out of the box, a realization that if one learns how to
learn they need not depend on schools...  if deployed correctly it can give
kids a tool that will excite them in their exploration of the world around
them - opening up new paths to creative inquiry where encouraging their
community to take rethink traditional rote learning of pre-digested approved
curriculum.

I suggest seeing OLPC in action in a remote/rural or  disadvantaged
community...   the greatest change will be visible where few options for
decent quality schooling are present.

best of luck on your study...   hope you will regularly report back to us...

Cheers
Tim

__________________________________
John "Tim"  Denny, Ph.D.
  Advisor- International Development, Education  and ICT
  Executive Director, PC4peace http://www.pc4peace.org
  Advisory Board, Masters of Development Studies -RUPP
  International Journal of Multicultural Education, Electronic Green Journal
  http://www.avuedigitalservices.com/VR/drjtdenny
 Join Cambodia Joomla! Users group - http://groups.google.com/jugcam

"The diligent farmer plants trees of which he himself will never see the
fruit." Cicero (106-43 BCE)


On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 10:12 PM, Magda Pischetola <magda_pischetola at yahoo.it
> wrote:

> Dear collegues,
>
> I've been reading with great interests your posts in the latest months and
> now I'd like you to ask your opinion about a topic that is going to be an
> important part of my research.
>
> I am doing my PhD in Italy with a project on the Digital divide from the
> point of view of Education. I am studying how can education reduce the DD
> with media literacy and how teachers can help children to achieve a good
> level of the so-called "digital skills", to access ICT and Internet and to
> produce development.
>
> Now, this year I will follow a field research in a primary school where
> teachers are going to introduce the OLPC laptop as a tool in their method of
> theaching. Then, in the new year I'd like to compare the results to another
> area of the world (I'm thinking of Buenos Ayres, Argentina).
>
> I'm asking to you all what you think - out of any preconcept that I might
> share - about the initiative of OLPC in the world (if it is a goof initiave
> or not and why) and which aspect would you stress in a field research like
> this one (e.g. skills of the teacher, self-learning of the child,
> creativity and flexibility of the project, etc.).
>
> I will appreciate very much your help.
> Thank you!
>
> Magda Pischetola
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Poco spazio e tanto spam? Yahoo! Mail ti protegge dallo spam e ti da tanto
> spazio gratuito per i tuoi file e i messaggi
> http://mail.yahoo.it
> _______________________________________________
> DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list
> DIGITALDIVIDE at digitaldivide.net
> http://digitaldivide.net/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide
> To unsubscribe, send a message to digitaldivide-request at digitaldivide.netwith the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.




--

From nb at bollow.ch  Fri Sep  5 04:44:21 2008
From: nb at bollow.ch (Norbert Bollow)
Date: Fri,  5 Sep 2008 10:44:21 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: [DDN] universal design (was: Web 2.0 leaves out people..)
In-Reply-To: <bb3c31460809040555n4c4a8f2au765bd66231528ad9@mail.gmail.com>
	(claude.almansi@gmail.com)
References: <20080702054303.n9f9qghheswwoso0@coyotecommunications.com>
	<bb3c31460807021240r5e9d4c1esdffa679c804af4f9@mail.gmail.com>
	<bb3c31460807021241o794464c4h9f8021a9b70aacc5@mail.gmail.com>
	<a06240898c4d43380f9f8@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460808220911r553780a2pbf5fee1582cde6ec@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080823113104.5188A220248@quill.bollow.ch>
	<a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2>
	<bb3c31460809020310m35f55aa4x27d6c28674a119ff@mail.gmail.com>
	<20080904120913.58DC14E8001@quill.bollow.ch>
	<bb3c31460809040555n4c4a8f2au765bd66231528ad9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080905084422.068CD220200@quill.bollow.ch>

Claude Almansi <claude.almansi at gmail.com> wrote:

> Norbert, I am no way a specialist of universal design - I don't
> design, let alone universally - so I hope others will answer your
> question as to its use for fighting the discriminations you list
> below.

Claude, thanks a lot for sharing these valuable thoughts and
reminding me that "universal design" is a term with an already
pretty fixed meaning (which alas happens to be much less broad
than I would have liked it to be, despite the adjective
"universal" being part of the term).

I suppose what I'm looking for is a broader alliance encompassing
more concerns than juts the areas of concern which are being
addressed by what is (at least currently) understood as being
"universal design".

The kind of broader alliance that I have in mind could perhaps be
called "universal freedom design alliance": In addition to the
concerns addressed by what is currently called "universal design",
topics of concern would also encompass "electronic freedom" topics
including privacy topics, freedom to use encryption, freedom to use
software that you can be freely modified without being as a
consequence locked out from impottant information sources, etc.

Greetings,
Norbert.


-- 
Norbert Bollow <nb at Adaptux.com>
Informatics Management and Consulting for Adaptability and Benefit/Cost
Optimization in Harmony with Human Rights and Needs

From cnd at knowprose.com  Fri Sep  5 04:50:24 2008
From: cnd at knowprose.com (Taran Rampersad)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 04:50:24 -0400
Subject: [DDN] PhD research on OLPC
In-Reply-To: <86879.20343.qm@web23708.mail.ird.yahoo.com>
References: <86879.20343.qm@web23708.mail.ird.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <48C0F2D0.1070508@knowprose.com>

Oddly enough, this morning I came across a true '$100 PC' in catching up 
on a few things:

http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS9413803799.html?kc=rss

"In October, Shenzhen China-based HiVision will ship a MIPs-based Linux 
mini-notebook for $98. The company is currently offering a similar 
machine for $120, according to a video blog report from the 
/Internationale Funkausstellunga/ (IFA) consumer electronics show in 
Berlin this week....

...The NB0700 pictured at right offers 512MB DDR2, a 30GB hard drive, 
and a 7-inch 800x480 backlit display. Other features include an Ethernet 
port, 802.11 b/g WiFi, two USB 2.0 ports, an SD card reader, microphone 
and speakers, and VGA output. The NB0700 is said to offer three hours of 
battery life and weighs just under two pounds (900 grams). The site does 
not specify what type of Linux is used..."



Magda Pischetola wrote:
> Dear collegues,
>  
> I've been reading with great interests your posts in the latest months and now I'd like you to ask your opinion about a topic that is going to be an important part of my research.
>  
> I am doing my PhD in Italy with a project on the Digital divide from the point of view of Education. I am studying how can education reduce the DD with media literacy and how teachers can help children to achieve a good level of the so-called "digital skills", to access ICT and Internet and to produce development.
>  
> Now, this year I will follow a field research in a primary school where teachers are going to introduce the OLPC laptop as a tool in their method of theaching. Then, in the new year I'd like to compare the results to another area of the world (I'm thinking of Buenos Ayres, Argentina).
>  
> I'm asking to you all what you think - out of any preconcept that I might share - about the initiative of OLPC in the world (if it is a goof initiave or not and why) and which aspect would you stress in a field research like this one (e.g. skills of the teacher, self-learning of the child, creativity and flexibility of the project, etc.).
>  
> I will appreciate very much your help.
> Thank you!
>  
> Magda Pischetola
>   
--
Taran Rampersad
cnd at knowprose.com

http://www.knowprose.com
http://www.your2ndplace.com
http://www.opendepth.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/knowprose/

"Criticize by Creating" - Michelangelo
"The present is theirs; the future, for which I really worked, is mine." - Nikola Tesla


From cotten at uab.edu  Fri Sep  5 12:04:50 2008
From: cotten at uab.edu (Shelia R Cotten)
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 11:04:50 -0500
Subject: [DDN] PhD research on OLPC
In-Reply-To: <22bb86510809050026r5875b3d8o2f327bbafa64582@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a062408a0c4d5d065fd33@10.0.1.2><86879.20343.qm@web23708.mail.ird.yahoo.com>
	<22bb86510809050026r5875b3d8o2f327bbafa64582@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <913A826691920944A642575D85BCE0B6814DED@UABEXMB8.ad.uab.edu>

Hi Magda. I don't know if you've heard or not but Birmingham, Alabama is
the first large scale dissemination of the XO laptops in the United
States. Birmingham is a high poverty city with around 90% African
American residents. I have a grant from the National Science Foundation
to examine the educational, career, and social impacts of the XO laptops
in Birmingham. We're focusing more on how technology usage changes and
the various types of impacts of this usage on the students and teachers.

I applaud your efforts to do field research on the impacts of the XOs. I
think there is a lot more research like this needed. I have just
recently learned that there is an anthropologist from Denmark who is
here in Birmingham doing some field research on the XOs. If you're
interested I'll be glad to pass along his contact info (with his
permission). You can email me off list if you'd like his info.

I look forward to hearing more about your work!

Shelia

*************************
Shelia R. Cotten, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
Department of Sociology
460N Heritage Hall
1401 University Blvd.
1530 3rd Ave. S.
Birmingham, AL 35294-1152
205-934-8678
cotten at uab.edu


-----Original Message-----
From: digitaldivide-bounces at digitaldivide.net
[mailto:digitaldivide-bounces at digitaldivide.net] On Behalf Of JTD
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 2:26 AM
To: The Digital Divide Network discussion group
Subject: Re: [DDN] PhD research on OLPC

Magda

Brilliant...   I  love what you are doing...  I am sort of envious as
there
are so many wonderful issues to research that I did not think of when I
did
my doctoral work..

Anyhow...   on to your topic...

there was a time when I was not a believer of  OLPC... yet I am
enlightened
now after viewing OLPC from an education perspective.

you ask for opinions...   yes it is an amazing initiative...  there have
been various computer projects that have brought to light the need for
low
power devices that are appropriate for emerging markets, yet it is
probably
OLPC that has opened more disruptive discussion on deployment in the
largely
ignored segment of those who cannot afford mainstream technology at
developed world prices.

Yet the real importance is that OLPC is not about the technology... sure
it
brings amazing technology to light... but lift the sheets and you will
see
it is about changing the way we teach and learn...  in my personal
opinion
it is about thinking out of the box, a realization that if one learns
how to
learn they need not depend on schools...  if deployed correctly it can
give
kids a tool that will excite them in their exploration of the world
around
them - opening up new paths to creative inquiry where encouraging their
community to take rethink traditional rote learning of pre-digested
approved
curriculum.

I suggest seeing OLPC in action in a remote/rural or  disadvantaged
community...   the greatest change will be visible where few options for
decent quality schooling are present.

best of luck on your study...   hope you will regularly report back to
us...

Cheers
Tim

__________________________________
John "Tim"  Denny, Ph.D.
  Advisor- International Development, Education  and ICT
  Executive Director, PC4peace http://www.pc4peace.org
  Advisory Board, Masters of Development Studies -RUPP
  International Journal of Multicultural Education, Electronic Green
Journal
  http://www.avuedigitalservices.com/VR/drjtdenny
 Join Cambodia Joomla! Users group - http://groups.google.com/jugcam

"The diligent farmer plants trees of which he himself will never see the
fruit." Cicero (106-43 BCE)


On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 10:12 PM, Magda Pischetola
<magda_pischetola at yahoo.it
> wrote:

> Dear collegues,
>
> I've been reading with great interests your posts in the latest months
and
> now I'd like you to ask your opinion about a topic that is going to be
an
> important part of my research.
>
> I am doing my PhD in Italy with a project on the Digital divide from
the
> point of view of Education. I am studying how can education reduce the
DD
> with media literacy and how teachers can help children to achieve a
good
> level of the so-called "digital skills", to access ICT and Internet
and to
> produce development.
>
> Now, this year I will follow a field research in a primary school
where
> teachers are going to introduce the OLPC laptop as a tool in their
method of
> theaching. Then, in the new year I'd like to compare the results to
another
> area of